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2003-11-14 14:39:37-08:00 - which episodes would be best? - (heathp_buffy@hotmail.com)


Hi Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. Thank you very much Heather

2003-11-14 18:18:58-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Dave Wilton <dave@SPAMwilton.net>)


On 14 Nov 2003 14:39:37 -0800, heathp_buffy@hotmail.com (Heather) wrote: >Hi > >Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my >friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would >like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these >days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. >Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on >a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have >Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on >which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and >I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want >to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > >So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would >be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, >and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need >some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my >departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. IMHO, the best single episode for this purpose is S2's Halloween. No knowledge of the show or the characters is required to enjoy it. It does not give away any significant plot developments. It is the most "stand alone" of all the episodes and it is one of the greats. Of course WTTH/TH is also a great introduction, but the beginning episodes are a bit uneven--the show was still finding it's feet. Prophecy Girl is good ep, but it kind of spoils the rest of S1 if your friend gets hooked. The Freshman is also a good ep for intros. As is S5's The Real Me. Most of the other good eps rely on some knowledge of previous plot/character developments. --Dave Wilton dave@wilton.net http://www.wordorigins.org

2003-11-14 22:04:19-08:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (felixcct@yahoo.com)


Heather wrote: > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy.[...] I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. This is a tough call. I've often wondered if there's any 1 or 2 episodes you could show someone who's prejudiced in advance to win them over, and I'm not sure there is. I would go with comedy, as someone else suggested. I don't think you should start with a story arc, no matter how great it is. Personally I think S4 The Initiative is hilarious, even though you do have to know a bit of the story. (Curse whoever made the decision not to include "Previously on ..." on the DVDs!!) Maybe Lovers Walk from S3. Good standalone ep with some funny moments courtesy of Spike, even though its not a comedy ep overall.

2003-11-14 22:32:34-06:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Thirsty Viking <jdoerter@kill.spam.comcast.net>)


"Peter Cowan" <pccowan@btopenworld.com> wrote in message news:bp3n24$7k4$1@sparta.btinternet.com... > > "Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > > Hi > > > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > > > Thank you very much > > Heather > > Well, the best place to start is the beginning - Welcome to the Hellmouth / > The Harvest. Then skip to Angel and Prophecy Girl, maybe via Never kill a > boy on the first date. > I agree, the first season. Start with the first couple episodes, if he likes them keep watching in order. Otherwise you still have time for a movie. First season is about right for 5 hour flight out and 5 hour flight back. There is value in continuity... you can also preface it with telling him some of the other seasons are better, but the way to watch if he likes them is to start at the begining.

2003-11-14 22:53:14+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (elsie <lcubbison@earthlink.net>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather Season 2 Buffy: Surprise, Innocence, Becoming 1 and 2 laurie

2003-11-14 23:04:36+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Peter Cowan <pccowan@btopenworld.com>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather Well, the best place to start is the beginning - Welcome to the Hellmouth / The Harvest. Then skip to Angel and Prophecy Girl, maybe via Never kill a boy on the first date. Peter

2003-11-14 23:06:34+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Eds <callmerazor@hotmael.com>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather I have just rewatched s4, and my fave this time round was definitely 'Who Are you' - the one where Buffy and Faith swap bodies, but that won't make sense to a newb I guess. The Harsh Light of Day is also good. It's hard to think of an ep that doesn't depend on prior knowledge of the characters... Going back to s3, Band Candy is a good one, but again it's Snyder etc acting out fo character that makes it funny. Similarly Dopplegangland. For some reason I'm favouring a funny ep. Like Beauty and The Beasts. Helpless is pretty creepy. Earshot is also angsty. Long time since I saw s1 or2 (at least 6 months...) Sorry, not coherent, it;s getting late and time for my nightly dose of Angel s2. Hope I've been some use. Eds

2003-11-15 02:10:48-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Melissa <mbangel10@comcast.net>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with.

2003-11-15 08:06:45-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Dave Wilton <dave@SPAMwilton.net>)


On Sat, 15 Nov 2003 02:10:48 -0500, "Melissa" <mbangel10@comcast.net> wrote: > >HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy >to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. Yes, it's great, but there is a lot of backstory to explain. You have the Initiative and Spike's chip and why he is living with Giles. And most of all, most of the humor derives from knowledge of the characters. A non-fan might like it, but to really appreciate it you have to be familiar with the show. I've found the worst thing you can do to convince someone who has never seen the show is try to explain the plot of any season other than S1. The plots are actually really silly when you lay them out, esp. S4. Better to just show them an ep that doesn't require explaining. The plots work on screen, but not as narrative. --Dave Wilton dave@wilton.net http://www.wordorigins.org

2003-11-15 08:57:22+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Eds <callmerazor@hotmael.com>)


"Melissa" <mbangel10@comcast.net> wrote in message news:GcadnXadS-PjTCii4p2dnA@comcast.com... > > "Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > > Hi > > > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > > > Thank you very much > > Heather > > HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy > to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. > Now why didn't I think of that? The perfect choice. Eds

2003-11-15 09:03:37-08:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (felixcct@yahoo.com)


"Melissa" wrote: > HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A good choice if you're watching on a portable DVD player in a noisy environment where it's difficult to hear. :-)

2003-11-15 10:33:27-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Horace LaBadie <hwlabadiejr@nospamhighstream.net>)


In article <5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com>, heathp_buffy@hotmail.com (Heather) wrote: > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather The Puppet Show. It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing credits. HWL

2003-11-15 10:34:26-06:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (drifter <skurj@REMOVEcharter.net>)


Eds wrote: > "Melissa" <mbangel10@comcast.net> wrote in message > news:GcadnXadS-PjTCii4p2dnA@comcast.com... >> >> "Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... >>> Hi >>> >>> Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my >>> friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would >>> like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these >>> days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. >>> Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going >>> on a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I >>> have Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose >>> from on which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set >>> with me, and I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he >>> refuses, I want to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour >>> flight?) >>> >>> So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would >>> be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be >>> okay, and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but >>> I need some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time >>> for my departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. >>> >>> Thank you very much >>> Heather >> >> HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >> Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing >> Buffy to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. >> > Now why didn't I think of that? The perfect choice. The nice thing about this choice is that not only is it funny AND scary, but for a lot of the show, you can explain some of the back story without having to worry about missing any of the dialogue. -- Kel _______________________________________________________ "Oh, Buffy. You really need to have every square inch of your ass licked." Darth Willow, kinda gay.

2003-11-15 10:51:19-06:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (drifter <skurj@REMOVEcharter.net>)


Dave Wilton wrote: > On Sat, 15 Nov 2003 02:10:48 -0500, "Melissa" <mbangel10@comcast.net> > wrote: > >> >> HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >> Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing >> Buffy to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. > > Yes, it's great, but there is a lot of backstory to explain. You have > the Initiative and Spike's chip and why he is living with Giles. And > most of all, most of the humor derives from knowledge of the > characters. A non-fan might like it, but to really appreciate it you > have to be familiar with the show. > > I've found the worst thing you can do to convince someone who has > never seen the show is try to explain the plot of any season other > than S1. The plots are actually really silly when you lay them out, > esp. S4. Better to just show them an ep that doesn't require > explaining. The plots work on screen, but not as narrative. > It seems to me that you're either going to like the show or you're not. In my own case, the very first episode that I saw was The Body, right at the spot where Willow couldn't find the blue one. This partial episode interested me enough that I started watching regularly, even though I didn't get FX at the time, and the local affiliate that carried the show jumped from season to season. Try going from one show from season 5, one from season 2, then 4, then 1, and make any sense of it, let alone get hooked on it. But I finally did. It was odd, going "What? Isn't Joyce dead? Where's Tara? Who's Oz? OK, WHERE'S Oz? Isn't Willow gay anymore? Wait, Buffy's an only child? Why is Angel evil?" Confusion reigned until I got FX. When they started Season 1 and went more or less in order, I made a Busy Icon for my Yahoo Instant Messenger that read, "Watching Buffy" from 5 to 7 PM. -- Kel _______________________________________________________ "Oh, Buffy. You really need to have every square inch of your ass licked." Darth Willow, kinda gay.

2003-11-15 11:27:21-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Arnold Kim <kim5@erols.com>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. I'm surprised no one has yet mentioned "Lie to Me", which is one of the best standalone episodes of the series. It's superbly written, and beyond understanding the basic setup of the series, it doesn't really require much context to appreciate the episode. The last couple of scenes alone have some of the best writing in the show. I'd also suggest "Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered," because, simply put, it's a damned funny episode. Arnold Kim

2003-11-15 12:50:45-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Cheryl LaFountain <lafount1@pilot.msu.edu>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > Hush! from Season 4. And then I'd show him a few Season 3 episodes, like Graduation pt 1 and 2...you could explain the back story easily enough. Or, show some Season 2 episodes. Becoming, etc. Cheryl

2003-11-15 14:29:09-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


Best options for Season 1: 1. "Welcome to the Hellmouth"--set up and mythology. 2. "The Harvest" (Season 1)--set up and mythology. 3. "Witch"--perfect standalone, captures tone. 4. "Out of Mind, Out of Sight" or "The Pack"--ditto. 5. "Angel" (weak) or "Prophecy Girl"--mythology and themes. I'd skip "Angel" and just fill him in on Angel's sitch. Season 2: 1. "School Hard"--dark humor, mythology, themes, tone. 2. "Lie to Me"--themes 3. "I Only Have Eyes for You"--just superb, though may give away too much mythology if he's going to follow it sequentially later. I'd honestly skip the classics like "Surprise" "Passion" and "Becoming I and II" for someone you're trying to convert, since so much of their power depends upon having already bought in to the characters and concepts. (Plus, if you do succeed in getting him hooked, you'll be doing him a favor by holding these back.) Season 3: 1. "Lover's Walk"--themes, tone, mythology--though it gives away too much regarding S2's developments that you'd have to explain. 2. "The Zeppo"--great stand alone, shows that the show didn't take itself too seriously all the time. 3. "Bad Girls"--especially if your friend is heterosexual. No hetero man can withstand the power of that Faith and Buffy dance, and it's otherwise a great episode. 4. "Earshot"--acessible done-in-one episode that's nevertheless strong on themes and tone. Season 4: I really wouldn't bother unless it's the incomparable "Hush" (which isn't likely to be all that impressive to a non-regular anyway). Possibly consider "The Harsh Light of Day," or "Fear Itself"--but, really, if you can't hook him with Season 2 and Season 3 episodes, you ain't gonna hook him. I've done this myself from time to time with friends and family. Basically, my experience has been that folks who don't take to "Witch," "The Pack," "Out of Mind, Out of Sight," or "Earshot" won't take to the basic concepts of Seasons 1-3, and those who don't take to "I Only Have Eyes for You," "Bad Girls," or "Lover's Walk" won't take to the darker themes and character arcs that become central to enjoying Seasons 2 and If you can't hook someone with either "Witch," "The Pack," "Never Kill a Boy.." or "Out of Mind, Out of Sight" from Season 1, actually, you're not going to be able to hook them at all, in my experience. Good luck--and report back on the results of your experiments! Season 3 -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-15 14:35:20-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


Melissa wrote: > > > HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy > to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. On the theory that it's a good idea to show them something that's essentially unlike every other episode of the series? :-) Sorry, I think "Hush" is a superb bit of TV and one of the top 5 BtVS episodes ever, but it makes a very poor introduction to the series for someone who's otherwise unfamiliar with the concept, the characters, the tone, the stylistic tics, etc. You might just as well show them "Once More With Feeling". :-) If you want an ep that's a bit special because it's a bit of a departure from the norm but which still gives enough of a sense of that norm for them to tell whether they're interested, go with "The Wish" or "The Zeppo," especially the latter. -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-15 14:39:34-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


Horace LaBadie wrote: > > > > The Puppet Show. > > It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new > use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing > credits. I agree completely, with one caveat (which is why I left if off my suggestions earlier): Some folks (raises hand) are *seriously* wigged out by dummies. If the potential convert in question is such a person, the cognitive static from that will be too great to allow one to enjoy the episode's characteristic strengths. Trust me. :-) -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-15 16:52:32+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (aej17DELETEME@comcast.net)


I would say "The Wish" and "Dopplegangland". You get both the tragic and comic, and you get see a lot of things happen in a short period of time. Also, one can appreciate those episodes without a lot of backstory. Something like "Becoming" is too dependant upon having seen the previous build-up. And "Dopplegangland" is worth it if only for Willow's line, "This just can't get more disturbing. Ack. Ew! You're really starting to freak me out!" I could watch that scene a million times, and I will still laugh out loud everytime. -- AE Jabbour "I mean, I may have ripped off Vertigo, The Shining, James Ellroy, James M. Cain, Barton Fink, Rebel Without a Cause, Vertigo, Psycho, Kiss Me Deadly, Double Indemnity and The Hudsucker Proxy - but I'm certainly no plagiarist!" Tim Minear, alt.tv.angel, 10.05.2000

2003-11-15 16:56:08+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (aej17DELETEME@comcast.net)


In alt.tv.angel Horace LaBadie <hwlabadiejr@nospamhighstream.net> wrote: > The Puppet Show. > > It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new > use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing > credits. An absolute classic episode. So often is it ignored in "best of" lists, but wrongly so. And Buffy looks so beautiful in that episode, too. That's an excellent choice, actually. -- AE Jabbour "I mean, I may have ripped off Vertigo, The Shining, James Ellroy, James M. Cain, Barton Fink, Rebel Without a Cause, Vertigo, Psycho, Kiss Me Deadly, Double Indemnity and The Hudsucker Proxy - but I'm certainly no plagiarist!" Tim Minear, alt.tv.angel, 10.05.2000

2003-11-15 18:07:34-08:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Merovingian <atthesea@comcast.net>)


> > Well, the best place to start is the beginning - Welcome to the Hellmouth / > The Harvest. Then skip to Angel and Prophecy Girl, maybe via Never kill a > boy on the first date. > > Peter > > I agree here, Welcome to the Hellmouth / The Harvest are such excellent episodes. If you have all of your season 1 disks with you, watch The Pack too. Daryl

2003-11-15 18:08:26+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Elizabeth Blake <poodlebone@NOSPAMearthlink.net>)


"Melissa" <mbangel10@comcast.net> wrote in message news:GcadnXadS-PjTCii4p2dnA@comcast.com... > HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy > to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. I tried to get my mother to watch Buffy a few times but she was never interested. When the Season 4 set came out, I was over at her apartment one weekend. When I decided to watch some Buffy, she didn't get up and leave as usual. Pangs was the next episode I was watching and I noticed that instead of reading her book, my mother was actually watching it. And then she watched Something Blue and Hush. She said she thought Hush was a little too scary but it was also the one she was most interested in. Overall, though, she really seemed to like Spike. Another one... Another time I had the Season 1 set over but she left in the middle of WTTH. She said that was too scary, too - she's not a fan of horror. After seeing some Season 4 episodes I think she realized that it wasn't all about horror. She also saw The Body when it was on a local channel one weekend. She moved a couple of months ago and just got cable, including FX which wasn't on her old system. I told her to watch FX every day at 4:00, but she probably isn't. She called me on Thursday and was very happy that she found Charmed on TNT. I told her she'd be using her time better by watching Buffy, or that she should at least be watching Angel before Charmed on TNT. Liz p.s. My mother is 70 years old

2003-11-15 19:21:41+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (ilmaestro <a.j.marshall@durham.ac.uk>)


On 15 Nov 2003 16:56:08 GMT, aej17DELETEME@comcast.net (A.E. Jabbour) proclaimed: >In alt.tv.angel Horace LaBadie <hwlabadiejr@nospamhighstream.net> wrote: >> The Puppet Show. >> >> It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new >> use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing >> credits. > >An absolute classic episode. So often is it ignored in "best of" >lists, but wrongly so. > >And Buffy looks so beautiful in that episode, too. That's >an excellent choice, actually. I agree. I posted about the brilliance of this episode a few days ago in the uk BtVS ng, and I think I would include it with WTTH/TH, 'The Pack', 'Angel' and 'Prophecy Girl' as an abridged Season 1, perfect for introducing someone to the show. -- ilmaestro "No you don't. But thanks for saying it."

2003-11-16 04:37:18+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (aej17DELETEME@comcast.net)


In alt.tv.angel George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net> wrote: > > > Horace LaBadie wrote: > >> >> >> >> The Puppet Show. >> >> It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new >> use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing >> credits. > > I agree completely, with one caveat (which is why I left if off my > suggestions earlier): > > Some folks (raises hand) are *seriously* wigged out by dummies. If the > potential convert in question is such a person, the cognitive static > from that will be too great to allow one to enjoy the episode's > characteristic strengths. > > Trust me. :-) One Buffy Anne Summers is such a person, if I recall correctly. BUFFY: They [dummies] give me the wig. Ever since I was little. WILLOW: What happened? BUFFY: I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. There really wasn't a story there. Man, that's a hilarious episode. And Sid is *such* a great character. -- AE Jabbour "I mean, I may have ripped off Vertigo, The Shining, James Ellroy, James M. Cain, Barton Fink, Rebel Without a Cause, Vertigo, Psycho, Kiss Me Deadly, Double Indemnity and The Hudsucker Proxy - but I'm certainly no plagiarist!" Tim Minear, alt.tv.angel, 10.05.2000

2003-11-16 18:17:06-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Cheryl LaFountain <lafount1@pilot.msu.edu>)


"George Grattan" <GGratone@netscape.net> wrote in message news:bp5v5o$fvp$1@bob.news.rcn.net... > > > Melissa wrote: > > > > > > > HUSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > > Great stand alone episode, and the gentlemen rock. If I were showing Buffy > > to someone for the first time this is the one i would go with. > > On the theory that it's a good idea to show them something that's > essentially unlike every other episode of the series? :-) > > Sorry, I think "Hush" is a superb bit of TV and one of the top 5 BtVS > episodes ever, but it makes a very poor introduction to the series for > someone who's otherwise unfamiliar with the concept, the characters, the > tone, the stylistic tics, etc. > > You might just as well show them "Once More With Feeling". :-) If you > want an ep that's a bit special because it's a bit of a departure from > the norm but which still gives enough of a sense of that norm for them > to tell whether they're interested, go with "The Wish" or "The Zeppo," > especially the latter. OMWF was one of the first Buffy episodes I ever watched and is what got me into the show. I think it's a mistake to assume that if an episode has a lot of backstory to it, then it won't be interesting to a newcomer. In fact, it made me curious to know more. But that's just my experience. Cheryl

2003-11-16 21:44:31-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


Cheryl LaFountain wrote: > OMWF was one of the first Buffy episodes I ever watched and is what got me > into the show. I think it's a mistake to assume that if an episode has a lot > of backstory to it, then it won't be interesting to a newcomer. In fact, it > made me curious to know more. But that's just my experience. > > I wasn't talking about backstory. I was observing that both "Hush" and "OMWF" (and we might as well through in "The Body" and possibly "Restless," as well), as great as they are, are also *significant* departures for the series in terms of tone, story, and direction. There are no doubt people who would be intrigued--as you were--by such unique episodes, but I think anyone looking to show an uninitiated viewer a good *and* representative episode of BtVS should look elsewhere. YMMV, of course, but I've known lots of folks who tuned in for both "Hush" and "OMWF" because of pre-show publicity (TV GUIDE and the like) and then were greatly disappointed by the show the following weeks, so much so that they never took up watching it. -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-16 21:49:04-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


A.E. Jabbour wrote: > In alt.tv.angel George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net> wrote: > >> >>Horace LaBadie wrote: >> >> >>> >>> >>>The Puppet Show. >>> >>>It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new >>>use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing >>>credits. >> >>I agree completely, with one caveat (which is why I left if off my >>suggestions earlier): >> >>Some folks (raises hand) are *seriously* wigged out by dummies. If the >>potential convert in question is such a person, the cognitive static >>from that will be too great to allow one to enjoy the episode's >>characteristic strengths. >> >>Trust me. :-) > > > One Buffy Anne Summers is such a person, if I recall correctly. > > BUFFY: They [dummies] give me the wig. Ever since I was little. > > WILLOW: What happened? > > BUFFY: I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. There really wasn't a story > there. And she gets it right on the nose, for me. It's like some folks with clowns: the fear is visceral and immediate, not necessarily because they had a bad circus experience or a too-early brush with Stephen King. For me and dummies, I'd never seen a single scary show or movie or read a single scary story with a dummy in it (didn't know of "Magic" 'til years later), but I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. To this day, I can remember being freaked out by the Chuck and Bob characters on "SOAP," and it was only through great force of will that I developed a fondness for Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy's routines. ('Course, it helps that a lot of their stuff can just be listened to.....with the whole "Ventriloquist on Radio" idea still somewhat a mystery to me....) -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-17 06:36:43+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Aethelrede <aethelrede@worldnet.att.net>)


George Grattan wrote in message ... > > >A.E. Jabbour wrote: > >> In alt.tv.angel George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net> wrote: >> >>> >>>Horace LaBadie wrote: >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>The Puppet Show. >>>> >>>>It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new >>>>use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing >>>>credits. >>> >>>I agree completely, with one caveat (which is why I left if off my >>>suggestions earlier): >>> >>>Some folks (raises hand) are *seriously* wigged out by dummies. If the >>>potential convert in question is such a person, the cognitive static >>>from that will be too great to allow one to enjoy the episode's >>>characteristic strengths. >>> >>>Trust me. :-) >> >> >> One Buffy Anne Summers is such a person, if I recall correctly. >> >> BUFFY: They [dummies] give me the wig. Ever since I was little. >> >> WILLOW: What happened? >> >> BUFFY: I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. There really wasn't a story >> there. > > >And she gets it right on the nose, for me. It's like some folks with >clowns: the fear is visceral and immediate, not necessarily because they >had a bad circus experience or a too-early brush with Stephen King. For >me and dummies, I'd never seen a single scary show or movie or read a >single scary story with a dummy in it (didn't know of "Magic" 'til years >later), but I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. To this day, I can >remember being freaked out by the Chuck and Bob characters on "SOAP," >and it was only through great force of will that I developed a fondness >for Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy's routines. ('Course, it helps >that a lot of their stuff can just be listened to.....with the whole >"Ventriloquist on Radio" idea still somewhat a mystery to me....) They were strangely popular back when. There was a show on the radio in Britain when I was a child that had a ventriloquist and his dummy. I freaked when I first saw it on TV, where it totally failed. There is something really nasty for me about the whole business of dummies and puppets. Except for "Punch and Judy", even though he does beat up on his wife, because it's so unreal and so meant to be unreal. Although I do remember a kid running away screaming at one point in a show. I think it was when they were trying to hang him. It was a long, long time ago. That bit has probably been politically corrected out by now, along with the wife beating, if people even exist who put that puppet show on these days without a huge government grant in some national theatre as a piece of traditional art.

2003-11-17 09:02:44-08:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (arthur@catapultclub.freeserve.co.uk)


heathp_buffy@hotmail.com (Heather) wrote in message news:<5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com>... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. Had past experience of this one, and have converted three people so far. One of whom swore blind he would hate it. And it's "Hush". No contest. Ok it's starts with the Buffy / Riley story, but just tell him to put up with that for 5 minutes. I didn't actually get hooked until season 3, and was of the same attitude. Took a lot of convincing just to get me to sit down and give it a try. Strangely, it was "The Zeppo" for me. A bit of a boys ep perhaps. Episodes that are overly comedic seem to work best, so Xander eps are a good idea (hey Xander used to get stories to himself once upon a time). "Fool for Love" won another friend over, but she has already been convinced by "Hush" alone. > > Thank you very much > Heather

2003-11-17 11:28:30-05:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net>)


Aethelrede wrote: > George Grattan wrote in message ... > >> >>A.E. Jabbour wrote: >> >> >>>In alt.tv.angel George Grattan <GGratone@netscape.net> wrote: >>> >>> >>>>Horace LaBadie wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>>The Puppet Show. >>>>> >>>>>It has all of the elements: a familiar device that it is turned to a new >>>>>use, lots of humor, some genuine pathos, and the hilarious closing >>>>>credits. >>>> >>>>I agree completely, with one caveat (which is why I left if off my >>>>suggestions earlier): >>>> >>>>Some folks (raises hand) are *seriously* wigged out by dummies. If the >>>>potential convert in question is such a person, the cognitive static >>> >>>>from that will be too great to allow one to enjoy the episode's >>> >>>>characteristic strengths. >>>> >>>>Trust me. :-) >>> >>> >>>One Buffy Anne Summers is such a person, if I recall correctly. >>> >>>BUFFY: They [dummies] give me the wig. Ever since I was little. >>> >>>WILLOW: What happened? >>> >>>BUFFY: I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. There really wasn't a story >>>there. >> >> >>And she gets it right on the nose, for me. It's like some folks with >>clowns: the fear is visceral and immediate, not necessarily because they >>had a bad circus experience or a too-early brush with Stephen King. For >>me and dummies, I'd never seen a single scary show or movie or read a >>single scary story with a dummy in it (didn't know of "Magic" 'til years >>later), but I saw a dummy, it gave me the wig. To this day, I can >>remember being freaked out by the Chuck and Bob characters on "SOAP," >>and it was only through great force of will that I developed a fondness >>for Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy's routines. ('Course, it helps >>that a lot of their stuff can just be listened to.....with the whole >>"Ventriloquist on Radio" idea still somewhat a mystery to me....) > > > They were strangely popular back when. There was a show on the radio in > Britain when I was a child that had a ventriloquist and his dummy. I > freaked when I first saw it on TV, where it totally failed. > There is something really nasty for me about the whole business of > dummies and puppets. Oddly, I *love* puppets. It's only dummies that wig me out. (Though particularly humanistic/realistic puppets can start to come close...) -- ------- Shalom, Peace, Salaam George

2003-11-17 16:46:31+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Can Altinbay <caltinbaytry123@earthlink.net>)


"Merovingian" <atthesea@comcast.net> wrote in message news:F4KdnR-Q__lwRiuiRVn-gQ@comcast.com... > > > > > Well, the best place to start is the beginning - Welcome to the Hellmouth > / > > The Harvest. Then skip to Angel and Prophecy Girl, maybe via Never kill a > > boy on the first date. > > > > Peter > > > > > > I agree here, Welcome to the Hellmouth / The Harvest are such excellent > episodes. If you have all of your season 1 disks with you, watch The Pack > too. > > Daryl > > My problem with these for introducing novices is that Buffy is still a lot like the movie Buffy, and I frankly don't think I would have kept watching given what she was like there. For the record, the first two episodes I saw were the ones in season 7 where Spike is influenced by The First. And then my wife and I saw most of the recent FX marathon together, and those episodes hooked her, too. she is the one who bought the first 4 seasons DVDs. -- How can you worship a homeless man on Sunday and ignore another on Monday?

2003-11-17 17:57:41+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (dsueme@core.com)


On 14 Nov 2003 14:39:37 -0800, heathp_buffy@hotmail.com (Heather) wrote: This is a really stupid question with a simple answer. But I am going to make you put a little work into it. It is the Buffy/Angel relationship arc that made the show. Reduce the first two seasons to the B/A arc and you have what you asked for - the kernel of Buffy. However, there is one little problem here. After seeing the 8 to 10 episodes of the arc, your convert need see only "Anne" and then he can blow the rest of the series off. There were funny episodes in seasons one and two, worth seeing. But seasons 4 and on - except "Beer Bad", utter crap. Dave >Hi > >Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my >friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would >like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these >days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. >Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on >a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have >Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on >which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and >I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want >to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > >So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would >be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, >and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need >some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my >departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > >Thank you very much >Heather When the Prime Minister spoke yesterday I thought to myself, "I hope I'll be able to give a speech like that when I grow up" - Bill Clinton, October 2, 2002 http://my.core.com/~dsueme/power%20lines%20mail.JPG

2003-11-17 20:32:07+00:00 - Re: which episodes would be best? - (Can Altinbay <caltinbaytry123@earthlink.net>)


"Heather" <heathp_buffy@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:5e8367d6.0311141439.33d9a88f@posting.google.com... > Hi > > Okay, I know this has been asked before, but I want to get one of my > friends to watch Buffy. He said that there is no way that he would > like the show, no if's and's of but's. I told him that one of these > days I was going to make him watch my DVD's, and he had no choice. > Well, I will finally have my chance to make him watch. We are going on > a business trip in December, and I have a portable DVD player. I have > Season 1-4 on DVD (Buffy) so, we only have those to choose from on > which to win him over. I dont want to take every box set with me, and > I dont want to bring too many, just for the fact if he refuses, I want > to bring some regular movies (can you say 5 hour flight?) > > So, everyone run to there Box Sets and tell me which you think would > be the best to show him. Me having to explain something could be okay, > and I think I would like to show him at least 2 episodes, but I need > some advice. I dont think season 5 will be released in time for my > departure, so it can only be season 1-4.. > > Thank you very much > Heather I asked my wife about this, and her choice, wonderful in my opinion, is to start with disk 4 from season 2. Surprise/Innocence sums up the situation beautifully between Buffy and Angel, allows the actors to show wide range, and has the requisite hit 'em ups for those who like that aspect as well. Phases and Bewitched..., together with these, really shows you a lot about all of the main characters and their relationships. On the return trip, you can start over from the top (season 1, disk 1). -- How can you worship a homeless man on Sunday and ignore another on Monday?