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2003-04-06 13:59:26+00:00 - New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


Hi, I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler space. "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice because he is about to die." Ugh! This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but foilers.

2003-04-06 13:59:26+00:00 - New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


Hi, I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler space. "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice because he is about to die." Ugh! This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but foilers.

2003-04-06 16:23:25-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Snuggles <postmaster@spamcop.net>)


In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com wrote: > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of guest spots I'm think he won't be dead.

2003-04-06 16:23:25-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Snuggles <postmaster@spamcop.net>)


In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com wrote: > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of guest spots I'm think he won't be dead.

2003-04-06 19:24:14-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (reldevik@usa.net)


dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. --Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some time ago, and became a hero. Clairel

2003-04-06 19:24:14-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (reldevik@usa.net)


dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. --Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some time ago, and became a hero. Clairel

2003-04-06 21:20:00+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. > >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some >time ago, and became a hero. > Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while Buffy went on patrol alone. I remember him heroically running away from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". I remember him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy. Oh wait, that last one never happened, did it?

2003-04-06 21:20:00+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. > >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some >time ago, and became a hero. > Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while Buffy went on patrol alone. I remember him heroically running away from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". I remember him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy. Oh wait, that last one never happened, did it?

2003-04-06 22:11:36-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (himiko@animail.net)


Snuggles <postmaster@spamcop.net> wrote in message news:<postmaster-E23828.16232506042003@husk.cso.niu.edu>... > In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com > wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. Yep. It's another version of the Riley farewell. Spike deserves better than that. Even a total rejection would be better than that. > > Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of > guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. Or won't be staying dead. himiko

2003-04-06 22:11:36-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (himiko@animail.net)


Snuggles <postmaster@spamcop.net> wrote in message news:<postmaster-E23828.16232506042003@husk.cso.niu.edu>... > In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com > wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. Yep. It's another version of the Riley farewell. Spike deserves better than that. Even a total rejection would be better than that. > > Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of > guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. Or won't be staying dead. himiko

2003-04-06 23:09:05+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. If the rumors are true that Marsters will be on Angel next year(ME has been known to misdirect things like this before), it's entirely possible that these spoilers are true and that Spike shansus to enable Spike to appear on Angel next year. All the Christ imagery for Spike this year finally starts making some sense.

2003-04-06 23:09:05+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. If the rumors are true that Marsters will be on Angel next year(ME has been known to misdirect things like this before), it's entirely possible that these spoilers are true and that Spike shansus to enable Spike to appear on Angel next year. All the Christ imagery for Spike this year finally starts making some sense.

2003-04-07 02:38:41+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - ("Jaime A. Cruz, Jr." <Spammers@Bite.Me>)


On Sun, 06 Apr 2003 16:23:25 -0500, Snuggles wrote: >In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com >wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > >Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of >guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. Death in the Buffyverse doesn't seem to mean a whole helluvalot. Only Jenny Calendar, Joyce Summers and Tara remained dead after being killed. Everyone else seems to have managed a miraculous recovery. And Jenny and Joyce have returned in spirit form a couple of times. Actually, now that I think of it... Tara's the only one who died and stayed dead! "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American people." - Theodore Roosevelt

2003-04-07 02:38:41+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - ("Jaime A. Cruz, Jr." <Spammers@Bite.Me>)


On Sun, 06 Apr 2003 16:23:25 -0500, Snuggles wrote: >In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com >wrote: > >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > >Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of >guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. Death in the Buffyverse doesn't seem to mean a whole helluvalot. Only Jenny Calendar, Joyce Summers and Tara remained dead after being killed. Everyone else seems to have managed a miraculous recovery. And Jenny and Joyce have returned in spirit form a couple of times. Actually, now that I think of it... Tara's the only one who died and stayed dead! "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American people." - Theodore Roosevelt

2003-04-07 06:25:50+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (fylmfan@aol.comspam)


Himiko wrote: > >Yep. It's another version of the Riley farewell. Spike deserves >better than that. I'll take that a step further. Every intelligent member of the viewing audience deserves better than soap opera drivel. Eh, but it's all over bar the shouting. They've probably finished shhooting the thing, so no point bitching about it endlessly now. Rose "No man is an island, entire of itself." -- John Donne Girls have human rights, too

2003-04-07 06:25:50+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (fylmfan@aol.comspam)


Himiko wrote: > >Yep. It's another version of the Riley farewell. Spike deserves >better than that. I'll take that a step further. Every intelligent member of the viewing audience deserves better than soap opera drivel. Eh, but it's all over bar the shouting. They've probably finished shhooting the thing, so no point bitching about it endlessly now. Rose "No man is an island, entire of itself." -- John Donne Girls have human rights, too

2003-04-07 12:49:21-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (reldevik@usa.net)


dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e909621.12468096@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: > > >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > >> Hi, > >> > >> > >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >> space. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >> because he is about to die." > >> > >> > >> Ugh! > >> > >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >> foilers. > > > >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with > >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the > >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually > >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of > >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy > >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. > >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music > >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. > > > >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! > >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally > >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some > >time ago, and became a hero. > > > > > Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while > Buffy went on patrol alone. --And you don't think the FE had anything to do with that? It was messing with Spike's mind for months, remember. I remember him heroically running away > from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". --He saved her life that way. Staying and fighting the demon would have been risky for Anya, as he explained. Besides, D'Hoffryn could always send out a different demon after Anya if he really wanted to. I remember > him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the > ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to > change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she > needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the > heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous > evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good > deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy --Now, now...baby steps, baby steps! Getting a soul after 100+ years as an evil vampire is a big adjustment. Certainly Angel did very little that was useful until 1997 (saving a puppy here and there seems to be the best that can be said for him) and even then Angel needed the urging of Whistler and the sight of cute little 15-year-old Buffy even to start becoming actively heroic. He was kind of slow about the heroism in season 1 of BtVS, even. We'll never know what Spike would have been capable of without the urging and supervision of Buffy. What if he had come back from Africa to find that Buffy had died while he was gone? And what if the FE hadn't been around to mess with Spike's mind when he returned to Sunnydale? Whole different situation. You can't prove that Spike wouldn't have risen to the occasion heroically. You can, of course, continue listing everything Spike has ever done that you find objectionable, while ignoring everything he's ever done that is brave and/or useful. But the only people you're going to convince are people who don't know the show well and can't think and watch for themselves. Big achievement. What you're going to have to face up to, if this spoiler is in fact true (which I think it probably is), is that Spike is going to do something wonderfully brave and heroic, which will put everyone in the Buffyverse in his debt. And Buffy will realize she's in love with him and will tell him so -- probably, at the same time, begging him not to sacrifice himself. Yet he will do so anyway because *he* knows it's the right thing to do. "Ugh!" indeed. Your discomfiture is my delight. Clairel

2003-04-07 12:49:21-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (reldevik@usa.net)


dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e909621.12468096@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: > > >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... > >> Hi, > >> > >> > >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >> space. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >> because he is about to die." > >> > >> > >> Ugh! > >> > >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >> foilers. > > > >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with > >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the > >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually > >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of > >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy > >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. > >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music > >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. > > > >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! > >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally > >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some > >time ago, and became a hero. > > > > > Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while > Buffy went on patrol alone. --And you don't think the FE had anything to do with that? It was messing with Spike's mind for months, remember. I remember him heroically running away > from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". --He saved her life that way. Staying and fighting the demon would have been risky for Anya, as he explained. Besides, D'Hoffryn could always send out a different demon after Anya if he really wanted to. I remember > him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the > ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to > change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she > needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the > heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous > evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good > deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy --Now, now...baby steps, baby steps! Getting a soul after 100+ years as an evil vampire is a big adjustment. Certainly Angel did very little that was useful until 1997 (saving a puppy here and there seems to be the best that can be said for him) and even then Angel needed the urging of Whistler and the sight of cute little 15-year-old Buffy even to start becoming actively heroic. He was kind of slow about the heroism in season 1 of BtVS, even. We'll never know what Spike would have been capable of without the urging and supervision of Buffy. What if he had come back from Africa to find that Buffy had died while he was gone? And what if the FE hadn't been around to mess with Spike's mind when he returned to Sunnydale? Whole different situation. You can't prove that Spike wouldn't have risen to the occasion heroically. You can, of course, continue listing everything Spike has ever done that you find objectionable, while ignoring everything he's ever done that is brave and/or useful. But the only people you're going to convince are people who don't know the show well and can't think and watch for themselves. Big achievement. What you're going to have to face up to, if this spoiler is in fact true (which I think it probably is), is that Spike is going to do something wonderfully brave and heroic, which will put everyone in the Buffyverse in his debt. And Buffy will realize she's in love with him and will tell him so -- probably, at the same time, begging him not to sacrifice himself. Yet he will do so anyway because *he* knows it's the right thing to do. "Ugh!" indeed. Your discomfiture is my delight. Clairel

2003-04-07 13:59:41+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On 7 Apr 2003 12:49:21 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e909621.12468096@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >> >> >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> >> foilers. >> > >> >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with >> >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the >> >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually >> >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of >> >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy >> >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. >> >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music >> >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. >> > >> >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! >> >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally >> >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some >> >time ago, and became a hero. >> > >> >> >> Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while >> Buffy went on patrol alone. > >--And you don't think the FE had anything to do with that? It was >messing with Spike's mind for months, remember. > > I remember him heroically running away >> from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". > >--He saved her life that way. Staying and fighting the demon would >have been risky for Anya, as he explained. Besides, D'Hoffryn could >always send out a different demon after Anya if he really wanted to. > > I remember >> him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the >> ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to >> change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she >> needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the >> heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous >> evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good >> deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy > >--Now, now...baby steps, baby steps! > >Getting a soul after 100+ years as an evil vampire is a big >adjustment. Certainly Angel did very little that was useful until >1997 (saving a puppy here and there seems to be the best that can be >said for him) and even then Angel needed the urging of Whistler and >the sight of cute little 15-year-old Buffy even to start becoming >actively heroic. He was kind of slow about the heroism in season 1 of >BtVS, even. > >We'll never know what Spike would have been capable of without the >urging and supervision of Buffy. What if he had come back from Africa >to find that Buffy had died while he was gone? And what if the FE >hadn't been around to mess with Spike's mind when he returned to >Sunnydale? Whole different situation. You can't prove that Spike >wouldn't have risen to the occasion heroically. > >You can, of course, continue listing everything Spike has ever done >that you find objectionable, while ignoring everything he's ever done >that is brave and/or useful. But the only people you're going to >convince are people who don't know the show well and can't think and >watch for themselves. Big achievement. > >What you're going to have to face up to, if this spoiler is in fact >true (which I think it probably is), is that Spike is going to do >something wonderfully brave and heroic, which will put everyone in the >Buffyverse in his debt. And Buffy will realize she's in love with him >and will tell him so -- probably, at the same time, begging him not to >sacrifice himself. Yet he will do so anyway because *he* knows it's >the right thing to do. "Ugh!" indeed. > >Your discomfiture is my delight. > >Clairel Clairel, hunny bunny, as I was reading your reply I was already formulating my own response. I was going to take apart your argument point by point and show you , once again, that Spike hasn't done anything good just for the sake of doing good but that everything that he did was "Buffy" motivated in some way or other. I was going to point out the effects that having a soul had on the resurrected Darla, over on Angel. I was going to ask you to provide some non-Buffy related evidence that showed that Spike was really a different person (by "non-Buffy related" I mean that you should not include any actions, or speechs, that Spike did for, or made to, Buffy) because I honestly haven't seen any. But your last statement sums up your position pretty clearly. "Your discomfiture is my delight." That pretty much says it all, doesn't it? When you take more pleasure in my nausea than the actual show that we're debating then there's really no point in continuing the debate is there? You pretty much just have your hands over your ears and are singing "I can't hear you" at the top of your lungs, aren't you? I'll tell you what. If the show does end the way that these spoilers are pointing to and I end up bent over the toilet, heaving into the porcelain bowl, I'll pause for a moment .... think of you .... and smile. Then continue puking. How's that sound? :)

2003-04-07 13:59:41+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On 7 Apr 2003 12:49:21 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e909621.12468096@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> On 6 Apr 2003 19:24:14 -0700, reldevik@usa.net (Clairel) wrote: >> >> >dunce@nomail.com wrote in message news:<3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> >> foilers. >> > >> >--Much as I love Spike and would like to have many AtS episodes with >> >him in them to look forward to in the future, posts like the >> >above-quoted one make me almost hope that the new spoiler is actually >> >true. (In sober judgment, I think there's quite a high likelihood of >> >it being true.) Spike dying nobly and heroically, with Buffy >> >professing her love for him, would be so, so satisfying...in a way. >> >The "Ugh!"s from those who think ill of this character would be music >> >to my ears, consoling me for the loss of Spike. >> > >> >Keep it up, Dunce, you're making this so much more palatable for me! >> >Maybe, just maybe, when you actually see episode 7. 22 it'll finally >> >penetrate your pointed cap that Spike stopped being a stalker some >> >time ago, and became a hero. >> > >> >> >> Yeah, I remember him heroically sitting in a bar in CWDP while >> Buffy went on patrol alone. > >--And you don't think the FE had anything to do with that? It was >messing with Spike's mind for months, remember. > > I remember him heroically running away >> from that demon that tried to kill Anya in "Get It Done". > >--He saved her life that way. Staying and fighting the demon would >have been risky for Anya, as he explained. Besides, D'Hoffryn could >always send out a different demon after Anya if he really wanted to. > > I remember >> him heroically needing his leather duster in order to screw up the >> ability to fight a demon, just like the way that Willow needs to >> change into one of her old highschool nerdy outfits everytime she >> needs to use her computer abilities. And I definately remember the >> heroic way that Spike was so overcome with remorse for his previous >> evil deeds as a vampire that he dedicated his new life to doing good >> deeds without the urging or supervision of Buffy > >--Now, now...baby steps, baby steps! > >Getting a soul after 100+ years as an evil vampire is a big >adjustment. Certainly Angel did very little that was useful until >1997 (saving a puppy here and there seems to be the best that can be >said for him) and even then Angel needed the urging of Whistler and >the sight of cute little 15-year-old Buffy even to start becoming >actively heroic. He was kind of slow about the heroism in season 1 of >BtVS, even. > >We'll never know what Spike would have been capable of without the >urging and supervision of Buffy. What if he had come back from Africa >to find that Buffy had died while he was gone? And what if the FE >hadn't been around to mess with Spike's mind when he returned to >Sunnydale? Whole different situation. You can't prove that Spike >wouldn't have risen to the occasion heroically. > >You can, of course, continue listing everything Spike has ever done >that you find objectionable, while ignoring everything he's ever done >that is brave and/or useful. But the only people you're going to >convince are people who don't know the show well and can't think and >watch for themselves. Big achievement. > >What you're going to have to face up to, if this spoiler is in fact >true (which I think it probably is), is that Spike is going to do >something wonderfully brave and heroic, which will put everyone in the >Buffyverse in his debt. And Buffy will realize she's in love with him >and will tell him so -- probably, at the same time, begging him not to >sacrifice himself. Yet he will do so anyway because *he* knows it's >the right thing to do. "Ugh!" indeed. > >Your discomfiture is my delight. > >Clairel Clairel, hunny bunny, as I was reading your reply I was already formulating my own response. I was going to take apart your argument point by point and show you , once again, that Spike hasn't done anything good just for the sake of doing good but that everything that he did was "Buffy" motivated in some way or other. I was going to point out the effects that having a soul had on the resurrected Darla, over on Angel. I was going to ask you to provide some non-Buffy related evidence that showed that Spike was really a different person (by "non-Buffy related" I mean that you should not include any actions, or speechs, that Spike did for, or made to, Buffy) because I honestly haven't seen any. But your last statement sums up your position pretty clearly. "Your discomfiture is my delight." That pretty much says it all, doesn't it? When you take more pleasure in my nausea than the actual show that we're debating then there's really no point in continuing the debate is there? You pretty much just have your hands over your ears and are singing "I can't hear you" at the top of your lungs, aren't you? I'll tell you what. If the show does end the way that these spoilers are pointing to and I end up bent over the toilet, heaving into the porcelain bowl, I'll pause for a moment .... think of you .... and smile. Then continue puking. How's that sound? :)

2003-04-07 14:17:26-04:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (DarkMagic <slnospambilan@comcast.net>)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > Okay, supposing this is true how would it play out exactly? Buffy: "Spike! No!" Spike: "Buffy, I have to! Listen to me we don't have much time! I've figured it all out! The reason I fell in love with you, got a soul, and have been rejected is so I wouldn't feel like I'm leaving anything behind when I jump into this portal to save the world." Buffy: "Oh, Spike! I do love you! I do!" Angel: "Huh? You do?" Buffy: "Yes! Yes, I do. All that garbage I've been saying for six years about only loving you Angel, that comment I just made a few months ago about never loving anyone as much as I love you, all those times I told Dawn and Spike that I didn't love him, oh PtB, I was totally mistaken! I had no idea how much I truly loved Spike here until this very moment when he's about to jump into that portal! Spike I love you!" Spike: "No, you don't. You're just saying that because I have to jump." Xander: "Uh, guys, the world's getting a little......you know....sucked up here, somebody want to jump already so we can this over with?" Angel: "I'll do it! I'll jump! Buffy doesn't only love me and Cordelia is evil now, my son is a juvenile delinquent who only answers to evil, I have no reason to exist!" Spike: "Oh no! I'm jumping! You always want to play the hero and steal my thunder! Well, nancy boy that's not happening this time! I'm jumping and no one is going to stop me!" Buffy: "Spike! No! Let Angel jump! It's you I love, only you!" Spike: "You don't mean that..." and so it goes as the world gets sucked up into hell, but the triangel continues...... -- Shannon Spike: "We're bringing Mother, of course. I think you'll like her." Druscilla: "Do you mean to eat?"

2003-04-07 14:17:26-04:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (DarkMagic <slnospambilan@comcast.net>)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > Okay, supposing this is true how would it play out exactly? Buffy: "Spike! No!" Spike: "Buffy, I have to! Listen to me we don't have much time! I've figured it all out! The reason I fell in love with you, got a soul, and have been rejected is so I wouldn't feel like I'm leaving anything behind when I jump into this portal to save the world." Buffy: "Oh, Spike! I do love you! I do!" Angel: "Huh? You do?" Buffy: "Yes! Yes, I do. All that garbage I've been saying for six years about only loving you Angel, that comment I just made a few months ago about never loving anyone as much as I love you, all those times I told Dawn and Spike that I didn't love him, oh PtB, I was totally mistaken! I had no idea how much I truly loved Spike here until this very moment when he's about to jump into that portal! Spike I love you!" Spike: "No, you don't. You're just saying that because I have to jump." Xander: "Uh, guys, the world's getting a little......you know....sucked up here, somebody want to jump already so we can this over with?" Angel: "I'll do it! I'll jump! Buffy doesn't only love me and Cordelia is evil now, my son is a juvenile delinquent who only answers to evil, I have no reason to exist!" Spike: "Oh no! I'm jumping! You always want to play the hero and steal my thunder! Well, nancy boy that's not happening this time! I'm jumping and no one is going to stop me!" Buffy: "Spike! No! Let Angel jump! It's you I love, only you!" Spike: "You don't mean that..." and so it goes as the world gets sucked up into hell, but the triangel continues...... -- Shannon Spike: "We're bringing Mother, of course. I think you'll like her." Druscilla: "Do you mean to eat?"

2003-04-07 14:30:25-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Hell Toupee <myob@notmine.com>)


> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > Okay, supposing this is true how would it play out exactly? Here's my fearless (and I always get it wrong) prediction: You may remember Spike's sardonic comment about wanting to be a 'real boy'. I've previously said it made me think of 'Pinocchio', which also suggests Shansu. So, let's call it foreshadowing. He's got his soul, he's part-way towards the requirements for the Shansu prophecy. Final episode: Buffy has her final battle and wins. The PTB reward her by freeing her from her roles as Slayer/Guardian of the Hellmouth. She's free to live a normal life. Spike does something perfectly heroic (like dying nobly) and is also rewarded by the PTB who restore him to life, and his humanity along with it. Now, finally, Spike can love Buffy as a man loves a woman. Now, finally, Buffy'll *see* Spike as a man, not a monster. Not so fast. Buffy realizes during the same epic battle that it's always been Xander who's been there for her. And now, **finally**, she's there for him. Buffy and Xander leave Sunnydale to ride off into the suburbia sunset, finally free to live normal lives...well, as normal as can be expected, considering their shared past experiences. Spurned Spike leaves Sunnydale, too. He has to make a new life for himself...now that he's got his life back... HellT

2003-04-07 14:30:25-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Hell Toupee <myob@notmine.com>)


> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > Okay, supposing this is true how would it play out exactly? Here's my fearless (and I always get it wrong) prediction: You may remember Spike's sardonic comment about wanting to be a 'real boy'. I've previously said it made me think of 'Pinocchio', which also suggests Shansu. So, let's call it foreshadowing. He's got his soul, he's part-way towards the requirements for the Shansu prophecy. Final episode: Buffy has her final battle and wins. The PTB reward her by freeing her from her roles as Slayer/Guardian of the Hellmouth. She's free to live a normal life. Spike does something perfectly heroic (like dying nobly) and is also rewarded by the PTB who restore him to life, and his humanity along with it. Now, finally, Spike can love Buffy as a man loves a woman. Now, finally, Buffy'll *see* Spike as a man, not a monster. Not so fast. Buffy realizes during the same epic battle that it's always been Xander who's been there for her. And now, **finally**, she's there for him. Buffy and Xander leave Sunnydale to ride off into the suburbia sunset, finally free to live normal lives...well, as normal as can be expected, considering their shared past experiences. Spurned Spike leaves Sunnydale, too. He has to make a new life for himself...now that he's got his life back... HellT

2003-04-07 18:58:12+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (fylmfan@aol.comspam)


>Subject: Re: New Spoiler >From: "DarkMagic" slnospambilan@comcast.net >Date: 4/7/2003 11:17 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <Qq6dncQpqIlPXQyjXTWcpA@comcast.com> > > > ><dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >Spike: "Oh no! I'm jumping! You always want to play the hero and steal my >thunder! Well, nancy boy that's not happening this time! I'm jumping and >no one is going to stop me!" > >Buffy: "Spike! No! Let Angel jump! It's you I love, only you!" > Ah, but the spoilers don't say Buffy only loves Spike. I heard that one of the Ducks said, apparently to comfort herself or himself, that Buffy says she loves Spike but she doesn't say she loves him as much as Angel. Some of us were trying to imagine the dialog if she did. "Oh, Spike before you jump to your grisly horrible death I want you to know I love you as much as I love Angel!" "Gee... thanks." Or, if the Ducks are right and she loves Angel more, she could say "Spike, don't jump! I love you, I do! Why I love you 85% as much as I love Angel!" (I have to credit another BAPster for that one.) "And furthermore, I love you 75% more than I ever loved Riley! The order is, first Angel, then you, the Riley, then Scott Hope, then Parker, then Faith...actually, Faith comes before Scott Hope..." The reason this is all so funny is that this is the inevitable result of months of fence-sitting. It becomes a matter of unintentional comedy rather than solid drama. Rose "No man is an island, entire of itself." -- John Donne Girls have human rights, too

2003-04-07 18:58:12+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (fylmfan@aol.comspam)


>Subject: Re: New Spoiler >From: "DarkMagic" slnospambilan@comcast.net >Date: 4/7/2003 11:17 AM Pacific Daylight Time >Message-id: <Qq6dncQpqIlPXQyjXTWcpA@comcast.com> > > > ><dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >Spike: "Oh no! I'm jumping! You always want to play the hero and steal my >thunder! Well, nancy boy that's not happening this time! I'm jumping and >no one is going to stop me!" > >Buffy: "Spike! No! Let Angel jump! It's you I love, only you!" > Ah, but the spoilers don't say Buffy only loves Spike. I heard that one of the Ducks said, apparently to comfort herself or himself, that Buffy says she loves Spike but she doesn't say she loves him as much as Angel. Some of us were trying to imagine the dialog if she did. "Oh, Spike before you jump to your grisly horrible death I want you to know I love you as much as I love Angel!" "Gee... thanks." Or, if the Ducks are right and she loves Angel more, she could say "Spike, don't jump! I love you, I do! Why I love you 85% as much as I love Angel!" (I have to credit another BAPster for that one.) "And furthermore, I love you 75% more than I ever loved Riley! The order is, first Angel, then you, the Riley, then Scott Hope, then Parker, then Faith...actually, Faith comes before Scott Hope..." The reason this is all so funny is that this is the inevitable result of months of fence-sitting. It becomes a matter of unintentional comedy rather than solid drama. Rose "No man is an island, entire of itself." -- John Donne Girls have human rights, too

2003-04-09 05:12:51+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Brian the Snorf <blehr@gladstone.uoregon.edu>)


"Jaime A. Cruz, Jr." <Spammers@Bite.Me> wrote in message news:wnvzrpehmanffnhjvatfbet.hcycof0.pminews@news-server.optonline.net... > On Sun, 06 Apr 2003 16:23:25 -0500, Snuggles wrote: > > >In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com > >wrote: > > > >> > >> Hi, > >> > >> > >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >> space. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >> because he is about to die." > >> > >> > >> Ugh! > >> > >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >> foilers. > > > >Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of > >guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. > > Death in the Buffyverse doesn't seem to mean a whole helluvalot. Only Jenny > Calendar, Joyce Summers and Tara remained dead after being killed. Everyone > else seems to have managed a miraculous recovery. And Jenny and Joyce have > returned in spirit form a couple of times. Actually, now that I think of > it... Tara's the only one who died and stayed dead! And that's mainly because Benson didn't want to return. That is, she didn't like what they wanted her to return for. -Snorf

2003-04-09 05:12:51+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Brian the Snorf <blehr@gladstone.uoregon.edu>)


"Jaime A. Cruz, Jr." <Spammers@Bite.Me> wrote in message news:wnvzrpehmanffnhjvatfbet.hcycof0.pminews@news-server.optonline.net... > On Sun, 06 Apr 2003 16:23:25 -0500, Snuggles wrote: > > >In article <3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca>, dunce@nomail.com > >wrote: > > > >> > >> Hi, > >> > >> > >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >> space. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >> because he is about to die." > >> > >> > >> Ugh! > >> > >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >> foilers. > > > >Considering that JM is in talks with the Angel crew for a couple of > >guest spots I'm think he won't be dead. > > Death in the Buffyverse doesn't seem to mean a whole helluvalot. Only Jenny > Calendar, Joyce Summers and Tara remained dead after being killed. Everyone > else seems to have managed a miraculous recovery. And Jenny and Joyce have > returned in spirit form a couple of times. Actually, now that I think of > it... Tara's the only one who died and stayed dead! And that's mainly because Benson didn't want to return. That is, she didn't like what they wanted her to return for. -Snorf

2003-04-09 07:44:35+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:16:12 -0400, "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote: > ><dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > > > >Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? >(And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > >Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy >and Angel. > >What's the difference? >Sandra > Angel followed Buffy around in order to help her and keep her safe. He never spent hours standing outside her house just looking at her. If he had he never would have had anything useful to tell her when they met. Spike's obsession was all about the way that Buffy made him feel. He never tried to help just because it was the right thing to do.

2003-04-09 07:44:35+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (dunce@nomail.com)


On Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:16:12 -0400, "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote: > ><dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >> >> Hi, >> >> >> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >> space. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >> because he is about to die." >> >> >> Ugh! >> >> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves >> her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >> foilers. > > > >Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? >(And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > >Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy >and Angel. > >What's the difference? >Sandra > Angel followed Buffy around in order to help her and keep her safe. He never spent hours standing outside her house just looking at her. If he had he never would have had anything useful to tell her when they met. Spike's obsession was all about the way that Buffy made him feel. He never tried to help just because it was the right thing to do.

2003-04-09 10:16:12-04:00 - Re: New Spoiler - ("Sandra S." <75211>, 522@compuserve.com)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy and Angel. What's the difference? Sandra

2003-04-09 10:16:12-04:00 - Re: New Spoiler - ("Sandra S." <75211>, 522@compuserve.com)


<dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > Hi, > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy and Angel. What's the difference? Sandra

2003-04-09 23:46:54-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (elizabethjanebailey@yahoo.com)


"Chris Zabel" <alephnull@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<ls2ka.12295$4P1.1062578@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>... > <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. > > If the rumors are true that Marsters will be on Angel next year(ME has been > known to misdirect things like this before), it's entirely possible that > these spoilers are true and that Spike shansus to enable Spike to appear on > Angel next year. All the Christ imagery for Spike this year finally starts > making some sense. I'll believe it when I see it. I seem to remember similar 'he's gonna die' rumours about both Oz and Xander for season four, none of which eventuated. My guess is, Joss and the ME people will be keeping as tight a lid as they can on the finale. The cast probably won't even get to see the finalised script until the last possible moment. Anything before that is pure speculation.

2003-04-09 23:46:54-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (elizabethjanebailey@yahoo.com)


"Chris Zabel" <alephnull@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<ls2ka.12295$4P1.1062578@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>... > <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. > > If the rumors are true that Marsters will be on Angel next year(ME has been > known to misdirect things like this before), it's entirely possible that > these spoilers are true and that Spike shansus to enable Spike to appear on > Angel next year. All the Christ imagery for Spike this year finally starts > making some sense. I'll believe it when I see it. I seem to remember similar 'he's gonna die' rumours about both Oz and Xander for season four, none of which eventuated. My guess is, Joss and the ME people will be keeping as tight a lid as they can on the finale. The cast probably won't even get to see the finalised script until the last possible moment. Anything before that is pure speculation.

2003-04-10 09:52:39-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Juleen <REMOVEsunryse@centurytel.net>)


Chris Zabel wrote: > "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message > news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... >> >> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >> news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> >>> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >>> space. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >>> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >>> because he is about to die." >>> >>> >>> Ugh! >>> >>> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy >>> loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >>> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >>> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >>> foilers. >> >> >> >> Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? >> (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? >> >> Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance >> between Buffy and Angel. >> >> What's the difference? >> Sandra > > There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he > started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her > bedroom window, starts stalking her. No it started when he saw a 15 yr old girl sitting on the school steps sucking a lollypop. Jul -- "I like roller coasters. Up-down Up-down Oh, what a ride. I always want to go again. It's interesting to me that a ride can make me so frightened, so sacred, so sick, so excited and so thrilled altogether. Some don't like it, they go on the merry go-round (or watch Gilmore Girls). That just goes around, nothing. I like the roller coaster. You get more out of it." (Grandma in the movie "Parenthood")

2003-04-10 09:52:39-05:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Juleen <REMOVEsunryse@centurytel.net>)


Chris Zabel wrote: > "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message > news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... >> >> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message >> news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> >>> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler >>> space. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. >>> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice >>> because he is about to die." >>> >>> >>> Ugh! >>> >>> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy >>> loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and >>> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her >>> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but >>> foilers. >> >> >> >> Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? >> (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? >> >> Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance >> between Buffy and Angel. >> >> What's the difference? >> Sandra > > There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he > started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her > bedroom window, starts stalking her. No it started when he saw a 15 yr old girl sitting on the school steps sucking a lollypop. Jul -- "I like roller coasters. Up-down Up-down Oh, what a ride. I always want to go again. It's interesting to me that a ride can make me so frightened, so sacred, so sick, so excited and so thrilled altogether. Some don't like it, they go on the merry go-round (or watch Gilmore Girls). That just goes around, nothing. I like the roller coaster. You get more out of it." (Grandma in the movie "Parenthood")

2003-04-10 12:43:00+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


"Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... > > <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. > > > > Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? > (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > > Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy > and Angel. > > What's the difference? > Sandra There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her bedroom window, starts stalking her.

2003-04-10 12:43:00+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


"Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... > > <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > > space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > > because he is about to die." > > > > > > Ugh! > > > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > > foilers. > > > > Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? > (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > > Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance between Buffy > and Angel. > > What's the difference? > Sandra There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her bedroom window, starts stalking her.

2003-04-10 18:42:38+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


"Juleen" <REMOVEsunryse@centurytel.net> wrote in message news:b740fr$ark6b$1@ID-184786.news.dfncis.de... > Chris Zabel wrote: > > "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message > > news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... > >> > >> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > >> news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > >>> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> > >>> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >>> space. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >>> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >>> because he is about to die." > >>> > >>> > >>> Ugh! > >>> > >>> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy > >>> loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >>> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >>> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >>> foilers. > >> > >> > >> > >> Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? > >> (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > >> > >> Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance > >> between Buffy and Angel. > >> > >> What's the difference? > >> Sandra > > > > There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he > > started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her > > bedroom window, starts stalking her. > > No it started when he saw a 15 yr old girl sitting on the school steps > sucking a lollypop. > Jul Even more disturbing way for Angel to meet his "true love". I had forgotten when that happened.

2003-04-10 18:42:38+00:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Chris Zabel <alephnull@earthlink.net>)


"Juleen" <REMOVEsunryse@centurytel.net> wrote in message news:b740fr$ark6b$1@ID-184786.news.dfncis.de... > Chris Zabel wrote: > > "Sandra S." <75211,522@compuserve.com> wrote in message > > news:b71apu$bkq$2@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com... > >> > >> <dunce@nomail.com> wrote in message > >> news:3e9030e0.3003407@news.hfx.eastlink.ca... > >>> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> > >>> I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > >>> space. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > >>> Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > >>> because he is about to die." > >>> > >>> > >>> Ugh! > >>> > >>> This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy > >>> loves her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > >>> proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > >>> "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > >>> foilers. > >> > >> > >> > >> Wasn't Angel her stalker, way back in season 1? > >> (And even after that, as recently as the PANGS episode)? > >> > >> Yet we were supposed to accept this epic star-crossed romance > >> between Buffy and Angel. > >> > >> What's the difference? > >> Sandra > > > > There is no difference. At least Spike got to know Buffy before he > > started stalking her. Angel, after just one glance peeping into her > > bedroom window, starts stalking her. > > No it started when he saw a 15 yr old girl sitting on the school steps > sucking a lollypop. > Jul Even more disturbing way for Angel to meet his "true love". I had forgotten when that happened.

2003-05-03 02:54:18-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Tim Bruening <tsbrueni@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us>)


dunce@nomail.com wrote: > > Hi, > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Also ugh that Spike doesn't realized that Buffy is serious!

2003-05-03 02:54:18-07:00 - Re: New Spoiler - (Tim Bruening <tsbrueni@pop.dcn.davis.ca.us>)


dunce@nomail.com wrote: > > Hi, > > I've found a new spoiler at Wendy's spoilerzone. Here's some spoiler > space. 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 > > > "In the final battle, Spike sacrifices his life to save the world. > Buffy tells him she loves him, but he thinks she is just being nice > because he is about to die." > > Ugh! > > This is exactly what I thought, and feared, would happen. Buffy loves > her stalker. Buffy put Spike ahead of her friends, family, and > proteges because of her personal feelings, not because he was her > "strongest warrior". I can only hope that this is all nothing but > foilers. Also ugh that Spike doesn't realized that Buffy is serious!