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2003-02-19 10:33:50-05:00 - My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>)


1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was always under the impression that her power came from something a bit bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely different things. Some clarification would be nice. Dan. -- Dan Posluns - remove "nospam" from my e-mail address to reply http://msw.mcmaster.ca/~poslundc ICQ: 35758902

2003-02-19 10:33:50-05:00 - My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>)


1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was always under the impression that her power came from something a bit bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely different things. Some clarification would be nice. Dan. -- Dan Posluns - remove "nospam" from my e-mail address to reply http://msw.mcmaster.ca/~poslundc ICQ: 35758902

2003-02-19 13:19:58-05:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Don Sample <dsample@synapse.net>)


In article <dan-69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca>, Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> wrote: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. "Demonic" is not a synonym for "Evil" We have seen that there are lots of non-evil demons running around the Buffyverse. Even if the demon that the power was extracted from was evil, the power itself might be neutral. Power is neither good, nor evil. It's how you use it that matters. -- Don Sample, dsample@synapse.net Visit the Buffy Body Count at http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/ Quando omni flunkus moritati

2003-02-19 13:19:58-05:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Don Sample <dsample@synapse.net>)


In article <dan-69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca>, Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> wrote: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. "Demonic" is not a synonym for "Evil" We have seen that there are lots of non-evil demons running around the Buffyverse. Even if the demon that the power was extracted from was evil, the power itself might be neutral. Power is neither good, nor evil. It's how you use it that matters. -- Don Sample, dsample@synapse.net Visit the Buffy Body Count at http://homepage.mac.com/dsample/ Quando omni flunkus moritati

2003-02-19 16:42:17+01:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not>)


Dan Posluns wrote: > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely > different things. Some clarification would be nice. Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the Hellmouth is the efficient way. Peter

2003-02-19 16:42:17+01:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not>)


Dan Posluns wrote: > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely > different things. Some clarification would be nice. Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the Hellmouth is the efficient way. Peter

2003-02-19 17:26:16-06:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - ("Rev. Cyohtee - O'k�home Ehohatse" <cyohtee@barbarian.org>)


Out of the ether Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> rose up and issued forth: >1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more >than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is >apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was >always under the impression that her power came from something a bit >bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her >pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... >and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. Sigh, here we go again...

2003-02-19 17:26:16-06:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - ("Rev. Cyohtee - O'k�home Ehohatse" <cyohtee@barbarian.org>)


Out of the ether Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> rose up and issued forth: >1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more >than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is >apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was >always under the impression that her power came from something a bit >bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her >pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... >and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. Sigh, here we go again...

2003-02-19 19:45:59+00:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Solomon <dansolo@attbi.com>)


Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> wrote in news:dan- 69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is > apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was > always under the impression that her power came from something a bit > bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her > pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... > and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. The average demon on Buffy is not a real demon. Remember Graduation Day and the Mayor's ascension? The demons on Earth are tainted. Real demons are much bigger and much more powerful. The power of the Slayer was most likely derived from a pure demon. -- Dan Solomon

2003-02-19 19:45:59+00:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Solomon <dansolo@attbi.com>)


Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> wrote in news:dan- 69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I understand that this is > apparently canon from Joss and his comics, but it still bugs me. I was > always under the impression that her power came from something a bit > bigger and more eternal. It helped convince me of things like her > pulverizing a god. Now it's just a spell, using the power of a demon... > and we know how unimpressive the average demon tends to be on Buffy. The average demon on Buffy is not a real demon. Remember Graduation Day and the Mayor's ascension? The demons on Earth are tainted. Real demons are much bigger and much more powerful. The power of the Slayer was most likely derived from a pure demon. -- Dan Solomon

2003-02-19 21:54:37-05:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>)


In article <3E53A5D9.7060600@nospam.not>, Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not> wrote: > Dan Posluns wrote: > > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that > > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched > > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his > > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely > > different things. Some clarification would be nice. > > Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? > > I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the > Hellmouth is the efficient way. This may be... but I always thought opening the Hellmouth would mainly mean unleashing those big snake-things that we saw in the two episodes that featured the Hellmouth opening. Dan. -- Dan Posluns - remove "nospam" from my e-mail address to reply http://msw.mcmaster.ca/~poslundc ICQ: 35758902

2003-02-19 21:54:37-05:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>)


In article <3E53A5D9.7060600@nospam.not>, Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not> wrote: > Dan Posluns wrote: > > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that > > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched > > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his > > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely > > different things. Some clarification would be nice. > > Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? > > I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the > Hellmouth is the efficient way. This may be... but I always thought opening the Hellmouth would mainly mean unleashing those big snake-things that we saw in the two episodes that featured the Hellmouth opening. Dan. -- Dan Posluns - remove "nospam" from my e-mail address to reply http://msw.mcmaster.ca/~poslundc ICQ: 35758902

2003-02-20 00:03:38+00:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (John Campbell Rees <jwcr@gardd-lelog.org.uk>)


During the course of this discussion, Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>, in message <dan-69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca> wrote: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I was always under the > impression that her power came from something a bit bigger and more > eternal. I like to think that the Shadowmen really had no idea what they were doing. They did an evil thing to the first Slayer, making her feral and inhuman. However, the whole Slayer situation has been taken over by "something a bit bigger and more eternal". It is obvious that the dark side has been toned down by the Powers for Good, as the Slayers we have encountered have been able to live in society, to get by unnoticed. -- "Like shooting flies with a laser cannon, the aims a bit tricky, but it certainly deals with the flies." - Lord Miles Vorkosigan.

2003-02-20 00:03:38+00:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - (John Campbell Rees <jwcr@gardd-lelog.org.uk>)


During the course of this discussion, Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com>, in message <dan-69817E.10335019022003@news.cogeco.ca> wrote: > 1. I didn't like that the slayer's power is rooted in evil, and more > than that, a demonic spell cast by humans. I was always under the > impression that her power came from something a bit bigger and more > eternal. I like to think that the Shadowmen really had no idea what they were doing. They did an evil thing to the first Slayer, making her feral and inhuman. However, the whole Slayer situation has been taken over by "something a bit bigger and more eternal". It is obvious that the dark side has been toned down by the Powers for Good, as the Slayers we have encountered have been able to live in society, to get by unnoticed. -- "Like shooting flies with a laser cannon, the aims a bit tricky, but it certainly deals with the flies." - Lord Miles Vorkosigan.

2003-02-20 13:32:31-06:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - ("Rev. Cyohtee - O'k�home Ehohatse" <cyohtee@barbarian.org>)


Out of the ether Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> rose up and issued forth: >In article <3E53A5D9.7060600@nospam.not>, > Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not> wrote: > >> Dan Posluns wrote: >> > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that >> > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched >> > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his >> > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely >> > different things. Some clarification would be nice. >> >> Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? >> >> I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the >> Hellmouth is the efficient way. > >This may be... but I always thought opening the Hellmouth would mainly >mean unleashing those big snake-things that we saw in the two episodes >that featured the Hellmouth opening. > >Dan. Actually, the big plant thing with all the tendrils shown in Prophecy Girl and The Zeppo was killed at the end of The Zeppo, making the opening more accessable to the rest of the demons that were to pour out of it. It was just the big one in front of the Ubies, and now it is gone and they are waiting their turn to go through. There are no doubt more demons behind them waiting their turn. -- Cyo cyohtee@ucan.foad.org http://www.barbarian.org/~cyohtee http://www.barbarian.org Brain: It proved that radio was a powerful tool. And now, Pinky, the advance of technology has brought us an even more powerful tool. Do you know what that is? Pinky: Ummm... the rubber band?

2003-02-20 13:32:31-06:00 - Re: My beefs with the new ep... - ("Rev. Cyohtee - O'k�home Ehohatse" <cyohtee@barbarian.org>)


Out of the ether Dan Posluns <dan@removeallexceptdanposluns.com> rose up and issued forth: >In article <3E53A5D9.7060600@nospam.not>, > Peter Mogensen <apm-at-mutex-dot-dk@nospam.not> wrote: > >> Dan Posluns wrote: >> > 2. I thought the problem was the hellmouth...? OK, I'll concede that >> > hordes of Ubies aren't exactly good news, but has the FE's plan switched >> > over from opening up the hellmouth to just finding a way to release his >> > undead army? Both spell bad news, but they're also two extremely >> > different things. Some clarification would be nice. >> >> Are we sure that the way to release the Ubies are not to open the Hellmouth? >> >> I mean.. it seems the seal only releases one at a time... maybe the >> Hellmouth is the efficient way. > >This may be... but I always thought opening the Hellmouth would mainly >mean unleashing those big snake-things that we saw in the two episodes >that featured the Hellmouth opening. > >Dan. Actually, the big plant thing with all the tendrils shown in Prophecy Girl and The Zeppo was killed at the end of The Zeppo, making the opening more accessable to the rest of the demons that were to pour out of it. It was just the big one in front of the Ubies, and now it is gone and they are waiting their turn to go through. There are no doubt more demons behind them waiting their turn. -- Cyo cyohtee@ucan.foad.org http://www.barbarian.org/~cyohtee http://www.barbarian.org Brain: It proved that radio was a powerful tool. And now, Pinky, the advance of technology has brought us an even more powerful tool. Do you know what that is? Pinky: Ummm... the rubber band?