FLM films - My Webpage

1996-06-06 00:00:00 - Let the series go! - ("Shannon T. Nutt" <shannon9@greenepa.net>)


My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something that doesn't have a chance of returning. We were provided with a season of great, intellectually stimulating television and a story that had a beginning, middle and an end. Did we really want ALL of our questions answered? Do those of you out there who are also hooked on the X-files really think Mulder will EVER find his sister, or learn the "truth"? The answer is NO! If NOWHERE MAN ends now, it will always be a classic for a small cult of followers. Remember...THE PRISONER only had 17 episodes (and frankly, not much of a conclusion, and it is considered one of the best TV shows ever made). I happen to be a true fan of NOWHERE MAN (watched it from day one, and have all the episodes on tape), and am willing to let it go. A return to TV on another network could be disasterous. What we love now could be turned into something terrible and unrecognizable. I have no objection to a series of two hour movies every year or so, though...it has proved to work nicely for ALIEN NATION, and it could work with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show (in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion.

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>I can't believe this! Are you really that eager to go back to making Hart >to Hart movies, Mr. Hertzog? You said yourself that NwM was the kind of >series that you wanted to make. Even if every single episode gets altered >in the dumbing clutches of the network, NwM is still far more >thought-provoking than anything else on T.V. Maybe you can't have every >creative decision go your way, but how does that change any if you return >to producing drivel for the masses? >What a shame - a man whose only quality more apparent than his obvious >talent is his self-stifling ego. You could have been the vanguard >inspiration for an entire new wave of intelligent T.V. but you >just gave up the fight and walked away. Instead of wasting your time >discouraging our save-the-show efforts, why don't you get back in the >ring where you belong and keep the network suits from winning another >battle? Jeffrey, It's always good to know that someone from the "outside of the process" can be as enlightened and informed as you assume yourself to be. You can't have what you think you want and therefore my ego is one of the self-stifling variety. Hey pal, if my ego were so self-stifling, there wouldn't be an alt.tv.nowhere-man for you to sound off on. The network isn't the source of the troubles at Nowhere Man. The studio is. The problems far transcend the "creative" decision aspect of the show. The show that you think you wanted me to "get back into the ring on" no longer exists at Disney in any way shape or form and they've turned control over to other people -- so there's no self-stifling going on. I have to say that of the entire year that I've corresponded with many, many people this is the first time I've had anything like this to say: You're an idiot. I'm depressed that my show appealed to you. Larry

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >that doesn't have a chance of returning. >We were provided with a season of great, intellectually >stimulating television and a story that had a beginning, middle and an >end. >Did we really want ALL of our questions answered? Do >those of you out there who are also hooked on the X-files really think >Mulder will EVER find his sister, or learn the >"truth"? >The answer is NO! If NOWHERE MAN ends now, it will always be a classic >for a small cult of followers. Remember...THE PRISONER only had 17 >episodes (and frankly, not much of a conclusion, and it is considered one >of the best TV shows ever made). >I happen to be a true fan of NOWHERE MAN (watched it from day one, and >have all the episodes on tape), and am willing to let it go. A return to >TV on another network could be disasterous. What we love now could be >turned into something terrible and unrecognizable. >I have no objection to a series of two hour movies every year or so, >though...it has proved to work nicely for ALIEN NATION, and it could work >with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN >belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud >the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show >(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. Larry

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (jmather@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu)


In article <31b7d0ba.53576046@usenet.interramp.com>, Larry Hertzog <larryh@interramp.com> wrote: >>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >>that doesn't have a chance of returning. . . . >>with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN >>belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud >>the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show >>(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. > > >Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. > >Larry I can't believe this! Are you really that eager to go back to making Hart to Hart movies, Mr. Hertzog? You said yourself that NwM was the kind of series that you wanted to make. Even if every single episode gets altered in the dumbing clutches of the network, NwM is still far more thought-provoking than anything else on T.V. Maybe you can't have every creative decision go your way, but how does that change any if you return to producing drivel for the masses? What a shame - a man whose only quality more apparent than his obvious talent is his self-stifling ego. You could have been the vanguard inspiration for an entire new wave of intelligent T.V. but you just gave up the fight and walked away. Instead of wasting your time discouraging our save-the-show efforts, why don't you get back in the ring where you belong and keep the network suits from winning another battle? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jeff Mather M.S. student, Computer Engineering University of Arizona

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (dahaa@primenet.com)


In article <01bb5410.6fa031c0$7a76cdce@nuttPPP>, "Shannon T. Nutt" <shannon9@greenepa.net> wrote: > My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something > that doesn't have a chance of returning. > We were provided with a season of great, intellectually > stimulating television and a story that had a beginning, middle and an > end. > Did we really want ALL of our questions answered? Do > those of you out there who are also hooked on the X-files really think > Mulder will EVER find his sister, or learn the > "truth"? > The answer is NO! If NOWHERE MAN ends now, it will always be a classic > for a small cult of followers. Remember...THE PRISONER only had 17 > episodes (and frankly, not much of a conclusion, and it is considered one > of the best TV shows ever made). > I happen to be a true fan of NOWHERE MAN (watched it from day one, and > have all the episodes on tape), and am willing to let it go. A return to > TV on another network could be disasterous. What we love now could be > turned into something terrible and unrecognizable. > I have no objection to a series of two hour movies every year or so, > though...it has proved to work nicely for ALIEN NATION, and it could work > with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN > belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud > the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show > (in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. _______ Kind thoughts, but I have to disagree. There is no greater pursuit for a fan of quality television than showing support for the few programs that actually rise above the dreck broadcast every day. Your assumption that the show might not proceed at the same level of quality is valid, but so is the possibility that it might. Why not cancel the X-Files now, in fear of some future season offering a diminished quality level and story line? Of course, that would be silly, as the X-Files arguably has just kept getting better and better. Why do you assume the same would not be true for Nowhere Man? And if there is a chance of a backslide on quality, why do you assume it couldn't also occur in the form of two-hour movies? Nowhere Man only belongs to the ages for those who see television as a passive act, rather than participatory. The reality is that there is little chance the show will ever return in any form (similarly, when Twin Peaks was cancelled, there was talk of a cable channel funding a third season, etc. but all that talk occurred just in that period of excitement right after cancellation.) But there is always a slim chance that viewer rebellion and sentiment will have an effect. Throwing cold water on that serves what purpose? We're not children. We need no reminder that the chance of renewal in any form looks grim. But you've just got to stand up for the few quality programs that appear and disappear, otherwise all shows will be dumbed down to the lowest common denominator. As for the X-Files, it too was dead after its first season. It was facing assured cancellation, but found an audience increase during faithful summer reruns on Fox. The network took a chance, renewed it that fall, and the rest is history. The X-Files is now Fox's highest rated program. And for those fans who do watch the X-Files, he's already discovered the "truth". Likewise, the chance of him finding his sister is good, better odds than a romantic relationship with his partner (there are many facets fueling this show, not just the sister hunt). And even if he never finds his sister, after years of hunting, so what? No reason to doom the show to a single year of cult status when you can mold it into a hit with careful nurturing. And that's the real challenge, Larry. It's easier to create the child than to raise it and shape it, isn't it. Not calling anyone a deadbeat dad, but this could be that rare show that comes along just once in anyone's career, like a Twilight Zone, or an X-Files. You certainly know better than any of us when to quit the fight, but I agree with another post: why toss cold water on a fandom effort to reignite this show? Not good. cheers to all who support quality television, david

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Alexander.Cheyney@mail.trincoll.edu)


larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: >>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >>that doesn't have a chance of returning. >>We were provided with a season of great, intellectually >>stimulating television and a story that had a beginning, middle and an >>end. >>Did we really want ALL of our questions answered? Do >>those of you out there who are also hooked on the X-files really think >>Mulder will EVER find his sister, or learn the >>"truth"? >>The answer is NO! If NOWHERE MAN ends now, it will always be a classic >>for a small cult of followers. Remember...THE PRISONER only had 17 >>episodes (and frankly, not much of a conclusion, and it is considered one >>of the best TV shows ever made). >>I happen to be a true fan of NOWHERE MAN (watched it from day one, and >>have all the episodes on tape), and am willing to let it go. A return to >>TV on another network could be disasterous. What we love now could be >>turned into something terrible and unrecognizable. >>I have no objection to a series of two hour movies every year or so, >>though...it has proved to work nicely for ALIEN NATION, and it could work >>with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN >>belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud >>the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show >>(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. > > >Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. > >Larry Who am I to diagree with this post. I do have a save NwM site up, but that is done primarily to raise attention to the show and because I have a sense of ridiculous optimism. I realize that "You can't go home" and that without LH's influence NwM would become a sad shell of a show. And most importantly I realize that we stand a snow ball's chance... Still, letting this great program slip into oblivion quietly is something I'm not willing to stomach. I would hope TT/Disney will stop yanking Larry's chain and let him write a TV movie or 2 (and let him have some creative control). Larry, I know Disney has really been rotten to you, and it seems from what you have told us that you have burned that bridge (at least as NwM is concerned), but stranger things have happened....(I'm a big Twilight Zone fan too-loved that Rod Serling) Please forgive me for my misplaced optimism. I am grateful for your efforts on this show and look forward to your next project. I only hope this project is a NwM movie....if not I still wait with interest...let me know. Thanks. Alex

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Chris Lonsberry <crl@norfolk.infi.net>)


> >with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN > >belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud > >the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show > >(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. > > > Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. > > Larry Hmmph! Don't get me wrong, the early NwM eps were in a class by themselves. The best word that applies is excellent. (Obviously I'm far from the only one.) But I'd rather have NwM on airing with any of the episodes and caliber of writing that I've seen, than to be consigned to Home Boys from Outer Space. The worst Nowhere Man episodes have been, at least, pretty interesting. Your reasons for getting away from it are your own business. It's a great loss to a great program. But I'd rather give someone else a try at it than to see it fade. (Now if Bruce left too... with both of you gone?... that's wearing it thin.) Chris

1996-06-07 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>And that's the real challenge, Larry. It's easier to create the child than >to raise it and shape it, isn't it. Not calling anyone a deadbeat dad, but >this could be that rare show that comes along just once in anyone's >career, like a Twilight Zone, or an X-Files. You certainly know better >than any of us when to quit the fight, but I agree with another post: why >toss cold water on a fandom effort to reignite this show? Not good. David, Based on my last reply to this thread, thanks for an intelligent (though one I disagree with) argument for keeping the show alive. Larry

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (starsk13@ix.netcom.com)


In <4p9p90$fh0@news.ccit.arizona.edu> jmather@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu (Jeffrey Mather) writes: > >In article <31b7d0ba.53576046@usenet.interramp.com>, >Larry Hertzog <larryh@interramp.com> wrote: >>>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >>>that doesn't have a chance of returning. >. >>>with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN >>>belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and >>>applaud the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the >>>premise of the show(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a >>>satisfactory conclusion. >> >>Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. >> >>Larry > Quite frankly, I'm not even going to repeat JMather's post. As for Mr. Hertzog, it's *his* show and he's just as entitled to his opinions as we are, probably more so. Good idea you had there JM, I'm sure "kicking him when he's down" will do wonders for reviving the show. But being in the business as long as he has, I'm sure he's seen this before. Some people do consider that TV producers, actors, etc. *owe* them something, rather than the other way around. Whatever happens, I for one am and will remain grateful to him for bringing us a bright spot in an otherwise dull TV-land. It occurs to me that I probably should just have ignored the post altogether. Sorry, but I just wanted to let Larry know that not everyone has turned against him. Leah

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (wilsons@calweb.com)


>In article <31b7d0ba.53576046@usenet.interramp.com>, >Larry Hertzog <larryh@interramp.com> wrote: >>>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >>>that doesn't have a chance of returning. NEVER! NEVER, I SAY!!! I will continue to fight as long as I have breath in my body. SEMPER FIDELIS!! . >>>.NOWHERE MAN belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and >>>applaud the fine minds behind the show .... I *am* applauding, and I *do* savor, but.... >>>(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. Well, in my opinion, the conclusion was far from satisfactory. The first thing I thought of after the final episode, is that it was like a salad. Yeah, a salad. You know. You go to a restaurant and you're REALLY hungry. After you eat your salad you're sort of satisfied, but after waiting another fifteen minutes for your entree, you're ravenous again. Yeah, Gemini was sort of like a salad. Or some soup. I'M STILL HUNGRY!!! Then Jeff said: >I can't believe this! Are you really that eager to go back to making Hart >to Hart movies, Mr. Hertzog? You said yourself that NwM was the kind of >series that you wanted to make. Even if every single episode gets altered >in the dumbing clutches of the network, NwM is still far more >thought-provoking than anything else on T.V. Maybe you can't have every >creative decision go your way, but how does that change any if you return >to producing drivel for the masses? >What a shame - a man whose only quality more apparent than his obvious >talent is his self-stifling ego. You could have been the vanguard >inspiration for an entire new wave of intelligent T.V. but you >just gave up the fight and walked away. Instead of wasting your time >discouraging our save-the-show efforts, why don't you get back in the >ring where you belong and keep the network suits from winning another >battle? I couldn't have said it better myself. While I am in awe of Mr. Hertzog's talent and creativity, and am appreciative that his brain-child offered me so many hours of nail-biting entertainment, I find it disheartening that he keeps pounding the nails into Tom's coffin as we all struggle so valiantly to rip them out. This show means an awful lot to a lot of us. I am kind of reminded of that Saturday Night Live episode where William Shatner tells the Star Trek fans at a Star Trek convention to "Get a Life". Lisa

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (IJBall@aol.com)


In article <31b8a943.19235109@usenet.interramp.com>, larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: > Hey pal, if my ego were so self-stifling, there wouldn't be an > alt.tv.nowhere-man for you to sound off on. But then I'd have "nowhere" to go! ;> (Couldn't resist.) > The network isn't the source of the troubles at Nowhere Man. Really. But I thought it was UPN that had essentially requested/demanded the "palmtop arc" (which still had some good episodes IMHO). > The studio is. I know very little about the "business". What exactly does Diseny own, and what exactly do you, as Creator/Producer/Writer own? Could you "take back" NwM from Disney? Or is that impossible? > The problems far transcend the "creative" decision aspect > of the show. The show that you think you wanted me to "get back into > the ring on" no longer exists at Disney in any way shape or form and > they've turned control over to other people -- so there's no > self-stifling going on. Meaning that you couldn't mount a "hostile take over"? And how exactly did Disney "force you out"? It seems like they couldn't unless you also agreed to go. (Isn't that what happened to Deborah Joy Levine on "Lois & Clark"?) In any case, what happens in the following scenario: NwM is not picked up anywhere else. You, as Creator, still want to tie things up with a final (TV) movie (many shows have done this, "Dynasty" is one) one or two years down the road. In such a case, would Disney really say "No", if you had some financing for it going in? Like I said, I know little about the "inside" of the "business", so I am just curious as to how hopeless it is in your situation. (But if this "business" is run anything like it is in HBO's "The Late Shift", I can understand why you want out...) -- Ian J. Ball | Want my TV episode guides or rec.arts.tv FAQ? Grad Student, UCLA | http://members.aol.com/IJBall/WWW/IJBall.html IJBall@aol.com | ftp://members.aol.com/IJBall3/FTP/ ijb@ucla.edu | "What to do, with time so short?..."

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>It occurs to me that I probably should just have ignored the post >altogether. Sorry, but I just wanted to let Larry know that not >everyone has turned against him. Leah, Thanks for the "vote." I really don't feel turned against but it irks me that someone who doesn't have a clue as to what went on "behind the scenes" is so forthright with opinions, particularly ones that define my character. Maybe this guy is a Disney "suit" in sheep's clothing :-) If not, he ought to be. It's just how they conduct themselves. Larry

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Chris Lonsberry <crl@norfolk.infi.net>)


> <shannon9@greenepa.net> wrote: > > > My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something > > that doesn't have a chance of returning. Then David wrote... > Kind thoughts, but I have to disagree. There is no greater pursuit for a > fan of quality television than showing support for the few programs that > actually rise above the dreck broadcast every day. > > Your assumption that the show might not proceed at the same level of > quality is valid, but so is the possibility that it might. Why not cancel > the X-Files now, in fear of some future season offering a diminished > quality level and story line? Or Voyager.... okay.. maybe in Voyager's case it would be okay to cancel but... > Of course, that would be silly, as the > X-Files arguably has just kept getting better and better. Why do you > assume the same would not be true for Nowhere Man? And if there is a > chance of a backslide on quality, why do you assume it couldn't also occur > in the form of two-hour movies? Personally, I think one would be hard pressed to answer all the remaining questions (and with every answer, there seems to arise new questions) in a way that would be entertaining and artistically acceptable in the bounds of the series. > But there is always a slim chance that viewer rebellion and sentiment will > have an effect. Throwing cold water on that serves what purpose? We're not > children. We need no reminder that the chance of renewal in any form looks > grim. But you've just got to stand up for the few quality programs that > appear and disappear, otherwise all shows will be dumbed down to the > lowest common denominator. [see above reference to Voyager] > the rest is history. The X-Files is now Fox's highest rated program. And > for those fans who do watch the X-Files, he's already discovered the > "truth". Likewise, the chance of him finding his sister is good, better > odds than a romantic relationship with his partner (there are many facets > fueling this show, not just the sister hunt). And even if he never finds > his sister, after years of hunting, so what? Did Stringfellow ever find his brother on AirWolf? > No reason to doom the show to > a single year of cult status when you can mold it into a hit with careful > nurturing. I could see the name Hertzog connected to NwM with the same reverence as Roddinberry / ST. Chris

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Depression - (vic33@usa.pipeline.com)


In reply to Jeffrey: On Jun 07, 1996 22:16:31 in article <Re: Let the series go!>, 'larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog)' wrote: <snip> >I have to say that of the entire year that I've corresponded with >many, many people this is the first time I've had anything like this >to say: You're an idiot. I'm depressed that my show appealed to you. Larry ----->>> now I'm depressed that Larry would call one of his fans an idiot. )-: Vic33@usa.pipeline.com http://pwp.usa.pipeline.com/~vic33/ Contact me if you'd like a pay phone for your Portland area business. There is NO CHARGE. :-) I have so much RAM, I don't NEED a hard drive. (-:

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (alantuck@usa.pipeline.com)


On Jun 07, 1996 17:35:28 in article <Re: Let the series go!>, 'jmather@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu (Jeffrey Mather)' wrote: >I can't believe this! Are you really that eager to go back to making Hart >to Hart movies, Mr. Hertzog? You said yourself that NwM was the kind of >series that you wanted to make. Even if every single episode gets altered >in the dumbing clutches of the network, NwM is still far more >thought-provoking than anything else on T.V. Maybe you can't have every >creative decision go your way, but how does that change any if you return >to producing drivel for the masses? > >What a shame - a man whose only quality more apparent than his obvious >talent is his self-stifling ego. You could have been the vanguard >inspiration for an entire new wave of intelligent T.V. but you >just gave up the fight and walked away. Instead of wasting your time >discouraging our save-the-show efforts, why don't you get back in the >ring where you belong and keep the network suits from winning another >battle? > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Jeff Mather M.S. student, Computer Engineering >University of Arizona The hot desert sun has clearly taken its toll on your common sense. Or maybe it's the stifling surroundings of the student body which has effectively severed your connection with the real world. Probably a potent combination of the two. It would be one thing if he owned the show. Maybe he owns a tiny piece of it. I seriously doubt it, but you'll have to ask him. What I *do* know is that Mickey, Goofy, Eisner, and their many, many minions own the lion's share. Or mouse's share, if you will. Since I own Disney stock, I guess I own the show as well, but nobody there has ever asked for my opinion. Maybe I should start attending shareholder meetings. Even if the show is given CPR, the Heimlich maneuver, a colostomy bag, and wheelchaired to Vancouver or an L.A. soundstage, Disney can do whatever they damn well please with it. Personnel matters, creative matters, budgetary matters. It is their budget, their money, their call, their absolute right. And even if they kissed and made up, there remains the issue of a pesky little nuisance known as a contract. Veil ain't the only pawn on this show. You may know a lot about computer engineering, but it is painfully obvious you know little about business. Maybe you should expand your curriculum to include a few business courses. College is a giant vacuum with little semblance to what you will encounter in the real world, but at least it might give you a little perspective. To borrow a page from the scripts of the Spinal Tapped studio/network version of NwM, get a clue. -Alan Tucker-

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Depression - (alantuck@usa.pipeline.com)


On Jun 08, 1996 01:48:27 in article <Depression>, 'vic33@usa.pipeline.com(Vic33)' wrote: >----->>> now I'm depressed that Larry would call one of his fans an idiot. >)-: > > >Vic33@usa.pipeline.com I just posted a response to Mather's post, and then stumbled across Larry's response, who had already beat me to it. Pretty heavy stuff, at least for Larry. There is another television producer online who, when replying to some of his fans, has shown definite clinical signs of Tourette's syndrome. Some pretty vile stuff. Out of his extensive repetoire of insults, the unique word "mind-fucker" immediately comes to mind. An Internet Andrew "Dice" Clay, this guy. Even so, the comparatively mild insult "idiot" *was* very un-Hertzogian. I just reread Mather's post. Some of it was pretty below the belt. If I had paid my career dues, had a tough year, had a hard day, and some idiot stood in front of me and said what he posted, I'd knock him out. Not online, but literally. With that being said, I think you're right. I guess it all comes down to a sense of professionalism, and holding a pseudo public figure up to a higher standard. I don't know if there should be a double-standard, but there is. After all, it's not like he's running for office. Regardless, it was a very poor choice of words. Maybe he should have used "incredibly cranially-challenged". But this makes you depressed? Wow. Try humming "The Theme to Larry Hertzog's Show". It's a peppy little tune, and should instantly put a smile on your face. Many New Age physicians now prescribe this as part of their "holistic" anti-depression therapy. -Alan Tucker-

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Depression - (larryh@interramp.com)


>There is another television producer online who, when replying to some of >his fans, has shown definite clinical signs of Tourette's syndrome. Some >pretty vile stuff. Out of his extensive repetoire of insults, the unique >word "mind-fucker" immediately comes to mind. An Internet Andrew "Dice" >Clay, this guy. Even so, the comparatively mild insult "idiot" *was* very >un-Hertzogian. Un-Hertzogian. Well you see, Alan, I was apparently coming off as too perfect. Now that you know, that "I, too bleed when pricked" doesn't it lend an authentic humanity which makes my prior constraints seem all the more commendable? Said, of course, with tongue planted deeply in cheek. Larry

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - Re: Depression - (larryh@interramp.com)


Larry ----->>> now I'm depressed that Larry would call one of his fans an idiot. )-: Vic, I've been appreciated (by most, not by all) for being forthright. That doesn't change because I'm being honest. To define someone's character when you don't even know the situation is the stuff that bigotry and other not-so-wonderful things are made of. I would repeat the statement and may at that. If this person were one of my friends, someone who was privvy to the daily goings-on and told me to "buck up," "don't weasel out," I'd accept it. I might have a differing opinion but it would be intended as constructive and I'd take it as such. This guy is just a little too smart and all-knowing for me. Perhaps he's running for "Director" in the "Organization." They need his type. Larry

1996-06-08 00:00:00 - ATTN LARRY! BIZ QUESTIONS (was Re: Let the series go!) - (David Filip <grimlock@u.washington.edu>)


On Fri, 7 Jun 1996, Larry Hertzog wrote: > Jeffrey, > > The network isn't the source of the troubles at Nowhere Man. The > studio is. The problems far transcend the "creative" decision aspect > of the show. How did this work? In the past you've told us that the "suits" tell you to do different things in your scripts, but you never told us how they made the decisions. Do they read the script from beginning to end and offer suggestions? I could imagine them saying "sorry, we don't want to have this guy's penis on fire. Try making him smoke a cigar so it'll be a Fruedian innuendo instead," but I'd like to know how the actual process really worked.

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


Ian, You've asked a lot of important questions though it's difficult to answer them all thoroughly in this forum. In short, I created Nowhere Man but Disney owns it. As the owner, I've contracted with them for my rights -- they're mostly financial. Currently, as long as NwM exists, it belongs to Disney. So as far as any "hostile" takeover you had in mind -- won't happen. Also, if there is any future to NwM in any form, it's unlikely Disney would surrender their ownership since it means potential $$s to them. They've already got an investment and would like as much product as they can get to recoup their expenditures. As far as how they "forced me out" -- I won't go into details here (it's not appropriate) but you'll have to take my word for it (or not). Of course, they can't force me out of my creator credit and any remuneration that has been contracted over that. If there were plans for a wrap up would Disney say "No?" I don't know what Disney would say. I know what I would say to them. There are a gazillion scenarios possible here because. given the show's cancellation, it's my bet that any contractual "services" have been nullified with the cancellation. (This doesn't include creator rights.) Whoever orders the additional product that you alluded to could insist on me, insist on my absence, not care at all. The buyer has a lot of power, obviously and nothing can be "projected" without knowing how the buyer feels. Of course, Disney could always refuse the buyer's terms and just not do it. As for your understanding why I want "out," I appreciate that. Keep in mind, however, that despite my "openess" in these forums, I have never really aired the "dirty laundry." I consider that to be in bad taste and, simply, inappropriate. So I'll interpret your "understand" as "empathize" since I don't believe that anyone on these groups has any notion about what went on. I know it often comes across as creative differences. Any one who's done what I've done for as long as I've done it has learned to live and get by with those. It is therefore, or should be, obvious -- that the differences are far more serious than that. I assure you, if there were any sort of venue where I could continue NwM, I would. Larry

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Lurking Suits? - (vic33@usa.pipeline.com)


On Jun 08, 1996 06:01:54 in article <Re: Depression>, 'larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog)' wrote: This guy is just a little too smart and all-knowing for me. Perhaps he's running for "Director" in the "Organization." They need his type. ---->>> After I heard that CNN had a short newsflash about the "Internet campaign to save Nowhere Man", I thought one or more of the networks might send a suit to check out this newsgroup (recall my post from a few days ago, if you saw it.) Perhaps this Jeffrey character is that person. Vic33@usa.pipeline.com http://pwp.usa.pipeline.com/~vic33/ Contact me if you'd like a pay phone for your Portland area business. There is NO CHARGE. :-) I have so much RAM, I don't NEED a hard drive. (-:

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (jdupree@ix.netcom.com)


In <31b7d0ba.53576046@usenet.interramp.com> larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) writes: > >>My friends, my friends...stop trying to save something >>that doesn't have a chance of returning. >>We were provided with a season of great, intellectually >>stimulating television and a story that had a beginning, middle and an >>end. >>Did we really want ALL of our questions answered? Do >>those of you out there who are also hooked on the X-files really think >>Mulder will EVER find his sister, or learn the >>"truth"? >>The answer is NO! If NOWHERE MAN ends now, it will always be a classic >>for a small cult of followers. Remember...THE PRISONER only had 17 >>episodes (and frankly, not much of a conclusion, and it is considered one >>of the best TV shows ever made). >>I happen to be a true fan of NOWHERE MAN (watched it from day one, and >>have all the episodes on tape), and am willing to let it go. A return to >>TV on another network could be disasterous. What we love now could be >>turned into something terrible and unrecognizable. >>I have no objection to a series of two hour movies every year or so, >>though...it has proved to work nicely for ALIEN NATION, and it could work >>with NOWHERE MAN...but don't get your hopes up folks....NOWHERE MAN >>belongs to the ages now, and we should savor what was produced and applaud >>the fine minds behind the show who did not betray the premise of the show >>(in my opinion, at least) and provided us with a satisfactory conclusion. In my opinion the show left us with a cliff hanger... and according to the trailers for the last episode, it was the season finale, not the series finale... THEREFORE there were full intentions of having the show return in the fall... ie - the show was _not_ meant to end at this point... so how can this possibly be a satisfactory conclusion? Consider the fact that all we know is that Veil is Gemini... well, what's Gemini? Oh well, I could go on, but I'm beginning to think that it wouldn't matter... -- ,,, (o-o) ==-=-=-=---.oOO--(_)--OOo.---=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-== Jean Dupree Spod Extraordinaire & Overall Silly Person http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/1073/ ==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-==

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: ATTN LARRY! BIZ QUESTIONS (was Re: Let the series go!) - (larryh@interramp.com)


> I could imagine them saying "sorry, we don't want to have this >guy's penis on fire. How do you know they didn't? The gory details are for those involved. If you really must know, join in. You'll love it. Thanks for your comments. I don't mean to be too brief but as I've said, I prefer to leave the details to those involved. Larry

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (jdvf@cris.com)


On Sun, 09 Jun 1996 00:15:57 GMT, larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: LH sez: >I assure you, if there were any sort of venue where I could continue >NwM, I would. > Hmm...would that include comic books? Many interesting stories have been told in that medium (Sandman (any issue), Watchmen, V for Vendetta, Miracleman, Dark Knight Returns). Could NwM 'make the leap' into a graphic novel format? Would you write for comics Larry? Who should do the pencils? 1/2 :-) jd

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: Depression - (jmather@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu)


In article <4pam5b$6vb@news2.h1.usa.pipeline.com>, Vic33 <vic33@usa.pipeline.com> wrote: >In reply to Jeffrey: >On Jun 07, 1996 22:16:31 in article <Re: Let the series go!>, >'larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog)' wrote: > ><snip> >>I have to say that of the entire year that I've corresponded with >>many, many people this is the first time I've had anything like this >>to say: You're an idiot. I'm depressed that my show appealed to you. >Larry > >----->>> now I'm depressed that Larry would call one of his fans an idiot. >)-: Hello, my name is Jeff Mather. At least, it used to be... (now it's "idiot", I guess) I was a lowly grad student. But I had it all... A sparring partner, Alan Tucker... Writing credits for Nowhere Puddin... And the respect of my fellow posters on alt.tv.nowhere-man. Yet in one moment it was all taken away from me, all because of a single posting. I wrote it... Mr. Hertzog hates it... And his minions will do anything to get me to refute it... I'm keeping a file folder of these replies to remind me that these postings are real... I know they are... They... have to be. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jeff Mather M.S. student, Computer Engineering (If only I had a cool jacket...) University of Arizona

1996-06-09 00:00:00 - Re: Depression - (jdupree@ix.netcom.com)


In <4pb50a$h4s@usenet2.interramp.com> larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) writes: > >Larry > >----->>> now I'm depressed that Larry would call one of his fans an idiot. >)-: Now whatever happened to the saying "sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never harm me?" Guess you were one of those people that needed therapy for "yo' mama" jokes... -- ,,, (o-o) ==-=-=-=---.oOO--(_)--OOo.---=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-== Jean Dupree Spod Extraordinaire & Overall Silly Person http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/1073/ ==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-==

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


Alex, Thanks for your post. Just for the record (and for the last time) my desire to let NwM sink into the sunset isn't some effort to "protect the integrity of the show." I'm not that much of a Pollyana. It has much more to do with "technical/legal" things. When I've said that [people] don't understand -- that's what I'm referring to. If NwM resumed without me, if the mouseketeers did their thing -- nothing I could do. It doesn't damage me because I've done what I've done and no one would blame/praise me for whatever was to come. My reasons go beyond the creative. Larry

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Tom Elmer II <tomelmer@deltanet.com>)


I was going to post later, but I couldn't resist replying to this one, since it addresses three things I wanted to comment on... On Sat, 8 Jun 1996, Chris Lonsberry wrote: [well, after editing] > > Your assumption that the show might not proceed at the same level of > > quality is valid, but so is the possibility that it might. Why not cancel > > the X-Files now, in fear of some future season offering a diminished > > quality level and story line? > Or Voyager.... okay.. maybe in Voyager's case it would be okay to cancel > but... There are 2 shows I make it a point to watch every week... Nowhere Man and Babylon 5. I got very tired of Voyager and stopped watching it for a while, but I really appreciated Nowhere Man. Now NwM is getting cancelled? In the lines of Unaired Pilot Network, I think the network should be renamed the Voyager Network (With Other Shows). They do not have a good track record. It can't be good for them. Viewers will be afraid to get hooked in a show for fear of cancellation, noone will want their show there.... (Maybe it's a conspiracy BEHIND UPN... *they* are trying to destroy the executives at UPN by rigging the ratings...) Anyways, I'll add my thanks to Larry for giving us a season of mental workouts. > > Of course, that would be silly, as the > > X-Files arguably has just kept getting better and better. Why do you > > assume the same would not be true for Nowhere Man? And if there is a > > chance of a backslide on quality, why do you assume it couldn't also occur > > in the form of two-hour movies? The reason I watched X-Files was for the exact things that were the core of NwM... Mulder as one person fighting against the government against all odds... Then, it turned into simply Alien-of-the-Week (Sorry... didn't mean to step on those toes my X-Phyle friends), but I had NwM to fall back on... *sigh* I'll miss the show, but too much has gone under the proverbial bridge to resurrect it, and I'm happy to let it die a semi-honorable death. About the movies, see below... > > the rest is history. The X-Files is now Fox's highest rated program. And > > for those fans who do watch the X-Files, he's already discovered the > > "truth". Likewise, the chance of him finding his sister is good, better > > odds than a romantic relationship with his partner (there are many facets > > fueling this show, not just the sister hunt). And even if he never finds > > his sister, after years of hunting, so what? > Did Stringfellow ever find his brother on AirWolf? *SIGH* Unfortunately... The same thing (I conjecture, not being in the 'business') happened to AirWolf. Somehow it was traded around and the whole show was recast.... under the premise that StringFellow had gone back and found his brother, but died in the attempt, or some such nonsense. So, AirWolf (the next mutation) had Singen(sp?) and someone else working with AirWolf and a new company... all with cheesy effects, etc.... it did NOT work... Without the creator (and the congregation all bows to the great Larry) the show would be VERY different... and in this real world, that often means worse. (Anyone for Highlander II?) As for movies from series, yes sometimes they work, but a majority of the time you have a disaster. (i.e. 'Indiana' MacGeyver and the Last Crusade.) (And I was one of those few people that ENJOYED Legend... yet another UPN show cancelled for later drivel...) > > No reason to doom the show to > > a single year of cult status when you can mold it into a hit with careful > > nurturing. Who's to say a cult status is a bad thing? Just look at Star Trek and The Prisoner... (Although, I'm sad to admit that there are just too few shows of NwM to go into syndication like ST...) All I can say is, Thanks for the party in your mind Larry... perhaps you can invite us all over again sometime... ...... and heave a big sigh ........ -----------------------------The Prisoner-------------------------------- _________ | | Thomas W. Elmer II _o_ _| ___=___ |_ _o_ tomelmer@deltanet.com thomelme@lasierra.edu /`-'\( ) ( )/`-'\ http://www.lasierra.edu/~thomelme/ | |-| ___@___ |-| | | | | (-+-+-+-) | | | Questions are a burden to others... | |--\_KAR120C_/--| | Answers a prison to oneself. `---' `---'

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Alexander.Cheyney@mail.trincoll.edu)


Man, this is a long thread. I posted something Thursday and it is gone. Larry, I appreciate you being so forthcoming yet you aren't slinging mud. I share in your ambivalence to see the show "saved". I don't want to see it turned into a "Fugitive" meets "The A-Team" from its original "Fugitive" in the "Twilight Zone" form. Still, we have grown very fond of Tom Veil. You have created a wonderful character, and Bruce Greenwood has portrayed him in a very convincing manner. This is a character that people have come to care about. This is where it starts. Not only have you created a wonderful character, you have put him into an incredibly tangled web of intrigue, while creating some real doubt as to our perceptions as viewers to what defines "reality". How can we sit by and quietly watch such a fine program die. I can't. I know that the "its just a TV show" and the "get a life" insults are there to be hurled, but I do have a wonderul, full life. I am married to Melissa Cheyney and we have a baby on the way. A small, but enjoyable part of our lives focused on the plight of a fictional, but well conceived character by the name of Tom Veil (Gemini). We have come to care about him and him and want to see how he extricates himself from this mess (If he ever does). You are right...none of us who are not involved in the production of a television series could not possibly understand what you went through with Disney. We can't even really empathize because we don't really understand. We can sympathize, because I can tell that you really care about the program and yet you want to see it end. That has to be painful. Again, thanks for being so forthcoming and for taking the time to respond to our e-mail and postings. Please forgive those of us who want to keep the show alive. Thanks. Alex larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: >>It occurs to me that I probably should just have ignored the post >>altogether. Sorry, but I just wanted to let Larry know that not >>everyone has turned against him. > >Leah, > >Thanks for the "vote." I really don't feel turned against but it irks me that >someone who doesn't have a clue as to what went on "behind the scenes" is so >forthright with opinions, particularly ones that define my character. Maybe >this guy is a Disney "suit" in sheep's clothing :-) If not, he ought to be. >It's just how they conduct themselves. > >Larry

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (alantuck@usa.pipeline.com)


In article <31bc5264.115730953@usenet.interramp.com>, larryh@interramp.com says... On Jun 10, 1996 19:37:26 in article <Re: "Idiot" or "Genius">, 'jlhatch@prolog.net (Jefferson Hatch)' wrote: Thanks for the reply. But don't get *me* wrong, I was not the original poster. I wrote to try to speak for those of us who want to continue the fight and keep NwM on, with fingers crossed that the "suits" don't rip its innards out. I know that if it does go to another network, or even stay with the same one that it could end up an entirely different colored horse, but maybe like Tom, who seems to have had other intentions forced on him, somehow his own character shines through, and maybe the core integrity of the show will be able to continue. The suits added definite directions this past year, and (despite Allan T's objections) I and many others still enjoyed them. The core integrity still shined through the inconsistencies and obvious tinkering. I think it has a lot to do with Bruce Greenwood's incredible acting. So like a parent watching your newborn grow and begin to move in its own directions, you're watching the world have its way with your creation, and it hurts to see it buffeted, put upon, and manipulated. But us "uncles" and "aunts" want to see your baby grow and thrive, and we're doing what we can, however feebly, to steer it back on course. "Uncle" Jeff Hatch ------------------------------------------------------- "Uncle" Jeff, First, my name is spelled ALAN. Yeah, I know, it's a common mistake. I've had many discussions with my mom over this one. And your parent analogy is way off-base, in my opinion. The newborn to which you are referring has grown up to be a punk teenager. As an uncle, I don't want this kid anywhere near my house. Even if he is my nephew. I caught the punk red-handed. He was going through my wallet. And you say the "core integrity" of the show still shined? Oh, the main story was still there. So, the core remained. The integrity was gone. And that shine you saw was just refractive light reflecting the drool of studio and network executives. Really, for fans who enjoyed the last four episodes, and want the show to return, there are always a few conspiracy episodes in every "X-Files" season to quench your thirst. And that is what the show had become. Not that they were bad, but it was a different show. The characters were the same, but somebody had gone in and extracted the soul. Unless you're a soul doctor, let the patient die. -Alan Tucker-

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (larryh@interramp.com)


>Thanks for the reply. But don't get *me* wrong, I was not the original poster. >I wrote to try to speak for those of us who want to continue the fight and keep >NwM on, with fingers crossed that the "suits" don't rip its innards out. I know >that if it does go to another network, or even stay with the same one that it >could end up an entirely different colored horse, but maybe like Tom, who seems >to have had other intentions forced on him, somehow his own character shines >through, and maybe the core integrity of the show will be able to continue. The >suits added definite directions this past year, and (despite Allan T's >objections) I and many others still enjoyed them. The core integrity still >shined through the inconsistencies and obvious tinkering. I think it has a lot >to do with Bruce Greenwood's incredible acting. >So like a parent watching your newborn grow and begin to move in its own >directions, you're watching the world have its way with your creation, and it >hurts to see it buffeted, put upon, and manipulated. But us "uncles" and >"aunts" want to see your baby grow and thrive, and we're doing what we can, >however feebly, to steer it back on course. Unc, I realize that you were not the original poster. That said, what I needed will be accomplished now by breaking any pre-existing contractual ties that I currently have with Disney. Once I'm free to leave, re-up, renegotiate or "never talk to them again" I'm less concerned about the show's future. Being tied to the keel of a galley ship (while it's sinking, BTW) wasn't my idea of fun. If NwM can have a life now, with or without me, and that pleases the fans -- great. As long as I have some say in my future. I believe that I do now -- but that wouldn't have occurred without the cancellation and some other few things. Go for it. Larry

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - "Idiot" or "Genius" - (jlhatch@prolog.net)


>I have to say that of the entire year that I've corresponded with >many, many people this is the first time I've had anything like this >to say: You're an idiot. I'm depressed that my show appealed to you. > >Larry Maybe he isn't an idiot. Maybe it was just a very conscious effort to get your ire up. If that was his intention (hmmm, "hidden intention" sounds like a good episode title) then he succeeded. Maybe he figured that you got the news early about the shows cancellation, went through your own processing about its demise, went to Europe and got over it by shmoozing with the Italian ladies. Meanwhile the snowball of effort to get NwM back onto the airwaves was the process that many of us have been going through, and it began small and grew over the four weeks while you were away. When you returned it was in full swing, with hope abounding -- even against the odds. But is it so surprising to find that the audience that rooted for TV every week has mounted an effort to thwart the decision *they* made? Maybe he was just trying to get you out of a mellow mood and onto the "let's fight" train that many of us are riding? Maybe he just wanted to sound enough like an idiot that you would respond from your gut, which is where many of us are with this whole process. Then again, maybe not, and he's just an idiot. Jeff "Originator of the David Letterman is the Head of the Organization Theory" Hatch

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (jlhatch@prolog.net)


In article <31bc5264.115730953@usenet.interramp.com>, larryh@interramp.com says... (the quoting below contains major snippage of both mine and LH's responses) > >>Maybe he isn't an idiot. Maybe it was just a very conscious effort to get your >>ire up. If that was his intention (hmmm, "hidden intention" sounds like a >Jeff, > >Well, get my ire up -- that's obvious. Congrats. Look -- I'm glad >you're passionate about the show. Clearly it was a work of passion >for me. It's gratifying, obviously, to know that my passion fired up >others. Extremely gratifying. It's what I've always hoped for. So >let's not underestimate my appreciation of the NwM fans. It's why I'm >here and why I've connected with so many people. > >As I've posted elsewhere -- if this were just a matter of "getting >back into the fight" -- no problem. If I was a quitter, I wouldn't >have been working steadily for as many years as I have. >If getting my ire was your task -- you succeeded. But the end that ^^^^ ^^^ >you might have hoped for (my getting back into the fight) wasn't. >Let's talk like "people" and take it from there. My calling you an >idiot was merely to indicate that any form of character (name calling) >attack sounds and feels mean-spirited and, most likely, is. > >That said, it should be interesting to watch how the "suits" handle >NwM's future. > >Larry Thanks for the reply. But don't get *me* wrong, I was not the original poster. I wrote to try to speak for those of us who want to continue the fight and keep NwM on, with fingers crossed that the "suits" don't rip its innards out. I know that if it does go to another network, or even stay with the same one that it could end up an entirely different colored horse, but maybe like Tom, who seems to have had other intentions forced on him, somehow his own character shines through, and maybe the core integrity of the show will be able to continue. The suits added definite directions this past year, and (despite Allan T's objections) I and many others still enjoyed them. The core integrity still shined through the inconsistencies and obvious tinkering. I think it has a lot to do with Bruce Greenwood's incredible acting. So like a parent watching your newborn grow and begin to move in its own directions, you're watching the world have its way with your creation, and it hurts to see it buffeted, put upon, and manipulated. But us "uncles" and "aunts" want to see your baby grow and thrive, and we're doing what we can, however feebly, to steer it back on course. "Uncle" Jeff Hatch

1996-06-10 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (larryh@interramp.com)


>Maybe he isn't an idiot. Maybe it was just a very conscious effort to get your >ire up. If that was his intention (hmmm, "hidden intention" sounds like a good >episode title) then he succeeded. >Maybe he figured that you got the news early about the shows cancellation, went >through your own processing about its demise, went to Europe and got over it by >shmoozing with the Italian ladies. Meanwhile the snowball of effort to get NwM >back onto the airwaves was the process that many of us have been going through, >and it began small and grew over the four weeks while you were away. When you >returned it was in full swing, with hope abounding -- even against the odds. >But is it so surprising to find that the audience that rooted for TV every week >has mounted an effort to thwart the decision *they* made? >Maybe he was just trying to get you out of a mellow mood and onto the "let's >fight" train that many of us are riding? Maybe he just wanted to sound enough >like an idiot that you would respond from your gut, which is where many of us >are with this whole process. >Then again, maybe not, and he's just an idiot. >Jeff "Originator of the David Letterman is the Head of the Organization Theory" >Hatch Jeff, Well, get my ire up -- that's obvious. Congrats. Look -- I'm glad you're passionate about the show. Clearly it was a work of passion for me. It's gratifying, obviously, to know that my passion fired up others. Extremely gratifying. It's what I've always hoped for. So let's not underestimate my appreciation of the NwM fans. It's why I'm here and why I've connected with so many people. As I've posted elsewhere -- if this were just a matter of "getting back into the fight" -- no problem. If I was a quitter, I wouldn't have been working steadily for as many years as I have. Trust me, you need an iron constitution. That said, Disney controls NwM. That's common -- writer's don't own their product in film and television -- nothing new. But, even during creative hostilities, there's a tacit, uspoken, agreement to act with, at least, the most basic of human decencies (ie, no murder, slaughter, etc.). Again, I won't go into details, but based on this year's series, Disney all but eliminated the "ring" to get back into (the "fight" as you say). It's not there (not for me). It's not a creative/ego thing -- they want it one way, I want it the other. If I had that kind of ego, you would've never seen the palmtop arc. The show would have been lotsa "Through a Lens Darkly(s)" "Something About Hers" "Spider Webbs" etc. There are legal (as well as emotional reasons) that I supported that original note about "let NwM die." I'm happy to go head to head with you or anyone else. I think that I've been open and honest (though I don't air the specifics of my troubles because I think it's unfair -- after all, I have this forum, they don't -- as much as I don't like them -- I'd like to think of my behavior as "better" -- that's the course I've taken. If getting my ire was your task -- you succeeded. But the end that you might have hoped for (my getting back into the fight) wasn't. Let's talk like "people" and take it from there. My calling you an idiot was merely to indicate that any form of character (name calling) attack sounds and feels mean-spirited and, most likely, is. That said, it should be interesting to watch how the "suits" handle NwM's future. Larry

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Max Novarex <novarex@mbox.vol.it>)


HI LARRY, i'm Max from Italy... i saw the show thanks to a friend of mine who taped all the episode for me.... i wish to thank you for all the hours of thrill and joy you gave me... i WANT the show to return on air.... there will be a lot of s... next year... SO... LET's HOPE.. MAX NOVAREX (ITALY)

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - TO LARRY FROM ITALY - (Max Novarex <novarex@mbox.vol.it>)


HI LARRY, i'm Max from Italy... i saw the show thanks to a friend of mine who taped all the episode for me.... i wish to thank you for all the hours of thrill and joy you gave me... i WANT the show to return on air.... there will be a lot of s... next year... SO... LET's HOPE.. MAX NOVAREX (ITALY)

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - Unaired Pilot Network - (jdupree@ix.netcom.com)


UPN is what airs Nowhere Man... maybe if people stopped bashing it and its name they would take us more seriously? Name calling is a bit immature -- ,,, (o-o) ==-=-=-=---.oOO--(_)--OOo.---=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-== Jean Dupree Spod Extraordinaire & Overall Silly Person http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/1073/ ==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-==

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - Re: Unaired Pilot Network - (aexia@u.washington.edu)


In article <4pki6o$8tb@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>, JD <jdupree@ix.netcom.com> wrote: >UPN is what airs Nowhere Man... maybe if people stopped bashing it and >its name they would take us more seriously? Name calling is a bit >immature The problem is that UPN deserves a great deal of the criticism it gets. And with the high turnover rate of UPN shows... Unsold Pilot Network does seem to fit... -- Micheal Keane(aexia@u.washington.edu) Get the Nowhere Man FAQ at my webpage: http://weber.u.washington.edu/~aexia Petition Fox and tell them you want a DOCTOR WHO series in the Fall! Join the Church of Last Thursday of Queen Maeve the Cat and be saved!

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (jjarrow@aol.com)


Hopefully, Alan, there *are* some soul doctors. The show is growing it's wings-- Star Trek : TNG wasn't that great until it's fourth season, either. I think that if NM is allowed back on, it will eventually reclaim that voice we love(and Tom will wear flannels again. <g>) -JJ ---------------- "A man without his pants leaves little room for explanation." Ramos, LEGEND "We're Starfleet officers, Mr. Kim. Weird is part of the job." Janeway, ST: VOYAGER

1996-06-11 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>All I can say is, Thanks for the party in your mind Larry... perhaps you >can invite us all over again sometime... I hope I get the chance on something even half as interesting as NwM. And you're all welcome in again -- Larry

1996-06-12 00:00:00 - Re: "Idiot" or "Genius" - (jlhatch@prolog.net)


(snippage for bandwidth's sake) >First, my name is spelled ALAN. Yeah, I know, it's a common mistake. I've >had many discussions with my mom over this one. I think I see what the "L" you're getting at. >And your parent analogy is way off-base, in my opinion. The newborn to >which you are referring has grown up to be a punk teenager. As an uncle, I >don't want this kid anywhere near my house. Even if he is my nephew. I >caught the punk red-handed. He was going through my wallet. And did you make any mistakes during your teen years? Did you turn out alright later? >And you say the "core integrity" of the show still shined? Oh, the main >story was still there. So, the core remained. The integrity was gone. So why did you continue to watch? >And that shine you saw was just refractive light reflecting the drool of >studio and network executives. Here I think I see what the "spit" you're talking about. >Really, for fans who enjoyed the last four episodes, and want the show to >return, there are always a few conspiracy episodes in every "X-Files" >season to quench your thirst. And that is what the show had become. Not >that they were bad, but it was a different show. The characters were the >same, but somebody had gone in and extracted the soul. Unless you're a >soul doctor, let the patient die. Actually I am. :-) The Rev. Dr. Jefferson "Never Say Die" Hatch

1996-06-12 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - ("Ellen B. Layendecker" <ellenlay@mediacity.com>)


> On Sun, 09 Jun 1996 00:15:57 GMT, larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) > wrote: > > LH sez: > >I assure you, if there were any sort of venue where I could continue > >NwM, I would. > > So, Larry, there still are NM stories to tell. The above answers my question as to whether you want to continue NM. The only question is can you. What would be your preferred venue? Novelization would allow more time for existential ruminations. Comics have been suggested, and they do provide an international venue. (X-Files can be added to that list). Any other suggestions? And, if there is no more Nowehre Man, do you have any ideas for other shows? Ellen

1996-06-12 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>And, if there is no more Nowehre Man, do you have any ideas for other shows? Ellen, I always have ideas. But, as I've said, NwM was a fluke in that UPN was new and didn't "know better." It's unlikely that anyone's going to let me do something like that again (and maybe for the better). I certainly will keep throwing these things at them, but don't be surprised if my next series is "Rex, the Crime Stopping Wonder-Dog." Such is life. Such is television. Larry

1996-06-14 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (cs.jrc@Forsythe.Stanford.edu)


In article <31bee0d8.33604688@usenet.interramp.com>, larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: > ... but don't be surprised if my next series is "Rex, the Crime Stopping > Wonder-Dog." I can see it now: The pilot opens with Rex sharing a bowl of kibble with his beautiful poodle mate. He wanders over to a nearby fire-hydrant, and when he comes back...she's gone! The whole things turns out to involve a conspiracy in the department to manipulate Rex's alleged color-blindness and what we may or may not have seen out on a "routine" traffic stop by the LAPD. Hey, I'd watch it.

1996-06-16 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>I can see it now: The pilot opens with Rex sharing a bowl of kibble with >his beautiful poodle mate. He wanders over to a nearby fire-hydrant, and >when he comes back...she's gone! The whole things turns out to involve a >conspiracy in the department to manipulate Rex's alleged color-blindness >and what we may or may not have seen out on a "routine" traffic stop by >the LAPD. >Hey, I'd watch it. I guess the pilot script's already leaked out. Oh well -- can't keep too many secrets around this town. Larry

1996-06-16 00:00:00 - Re: TO LARRY FROM ITALY - (CWZY26B@prodigy.com)


Do more than hope...write. http://pages.prodigy.com/nowhere-man Check out my site that has info on how to save the show.

1996-06-18 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (curt_marshall <cmars@enet.colmicrosys.com>)


> Alex > > PS. Seriously, Larry we are all waiting for your next project with bated breath > (or furry tounge); whatever it is. It will tough to top your last effort...but you have earned a great > deal of respect and appreciation from those of us who have enjoyed NwM (no...Larry > is not paying me for the above comment or for any PR. I know this sounds sickening > but it is heartfelt appreciation). Thanks! Alex --- I feel the same way. Regardless of the cynics it just seems right to thank the person responsible when you have a fine an effort as Nowhere Man. --- Curt Marshall

1996-06-18 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (Alexander.Cheyney@mail.trincoll.edu)


larryh@interramp.com (Larry Hertzog) wrote: >>I can see it now: The pilot opens with Rex sharing a bowl of kibble with >>his beautiful poodle mate. He wanders over to a nearby fire-hydrant, and >>when he comes back...she's gone! The whole things turns out to involve a >>conspiracy in the department to manipulate Rex's alleged color-blindness >>and what we may or may not have seen out on a "routine" traffic stop by >>the LAPD. > >>Hey, I'd watch it. > >I guess the pilot script's already leaked out. Oh well -- can't keep >too many secrets around this town. > >Larry Hey Larry-Let me know when they set up alt.tv.rex-crime-dog we could get into heated discussions about dog food brands and favorite chew toys... Alex PS. Seriously, Larry we are all waiting for your next project with bated breath (or furry tounge); whatever it is. It will tough to top your last effort...but you have earned a great deal of respect and appreciation from those of us who have enjoyed NwM (no...Larry is not paying me for the above comment or for any PR. I know this sounds sickening but it is heartfelt appreciation). Thanks!

1996-06-19 00:00:00 - Re: Let the series go! - (larryh@interramp.com)


>Hey Larry-Let me know when they set up alt.tv.rex-crime-dog >we could get into heated discussions about dog food brands and >favorite chew toys... >Alex >PS. Seriously, Larry we are all waiting for your next project with bated breath >(or furry tounge); whatever it is. It will tough to top your last effort...but you have earned a great >deal of respect and appreciation from those of us who have enjoyed NwM (no...Larry >is not paying me for the above comment or for any PR. I know this sounds sickening >but it is heartfelt appreciation). Thanks! You're more than welcome. Every bit of it was my pleasure as has been interracting with all of you. Larry