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2000-06-24 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Wavemaker <wavemaker@my-deja.com>)


"Wickeddoll" wrote: > > And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha > Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... She may be ostracized from most of society because of her Borg background. At the very least, I think her reception in the Alpha quadrant will be mixed. Also, I can imagine Starfleet's engineers and scientists being very interested in her the same way they were in Data in "The Measure of the Man." She may find herself in a place where she has to defend against having her freedom, and more, violated.

2000-06-24 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - ("Norm G." <auto34997@hushmail.com>)


So many lost loved ones to the Borg, that Seven would have to be protected. I've seen a lot of revenge type stuff in Trek, and Seven would be a prime Target. Now I have now idea how old Kneelicks would fit in. I guess based on some past episodes that transwarp would allow for short trips back, and he might be able to go back home in a few months on the federations latest transwarp new ship. Now Seven would also face a lot of things, you know dog gone well Star Fleet would want to take Seven apart at the seams to gain any info over the Borg that they could. I could imagine also that they would lock her up, and Janeway would be told that there is nothing she can do, and that seven could be a spy. I could see a rescue mission like Captain Kirk did in the movie "The Search for Spock" And a whole new series... Wavemaker <wavemaker@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:yNc55.8958$Mj72.98631986@news.randori.com... "Wickeddoll" wrote: > > And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha > Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... She may be ostracized from most of society because of her Borg background. At the very least, I think her reception in the Alpha quadrant will be mixed. Also, I can imagine Starfleet's engineers and scientists being very interested in her the same way they were in Data in "The Measure of the Man." She may find herself in a place where she has to defend against having her freedom, and more, violated.

2000-06-24 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Lisa <lisa@chakfan.com>)


"Wickeddoll" <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:kGa55.37303$FC6.848527@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net... > With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not > particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant > threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really > would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! I'm hoping for there to be a Maquis revival. I'd like to see them worried about Starfleets intentions towards them,( as hinted at in one ep this season that I cant remember the name of because I've got a cold and I'm knackered <g>) and considering abandoning ship or something like that. Then we could have Tom in a dilemma over leaving B'Elana, Seven might decide to opt out as well, Tuvok would remain true to Starfleet, Harry would probably love to go but not have enough guts to do it. It could provide for some very interesting conflict. > > Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their > feelings for each other, or get on with it! They should have left it dead and buried, for the life of me I dont understand why they have started hinting at it again. > > And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha > Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... OK, I can imagine one thing > some of them would want to do with her, but you know what I mean. ;) LOL, I can think of a couple of places in Texas and Washington where there are two people who would love to help her discover herself <g> Lisa

2000-06-24 00:00:00 - How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Wickeddoll <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com>)


With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their feelings for each other, or get on with it! And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... OK, I can imagine one thing some of them would want to do with her, but you know what I mean. ;) hehehe Whaddya think? Natalie -- http://members.xoom.com/MelodyA/lfn.htm "Wicked little doll, you are not human" "Wicked little doll, you have no soul" (David Byrne, 1997)

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"Bozo the Evil Klown" <evilklowwn@aol.comedy> wrote in message news:20000625144848.04767.00000854@ng-cp1.aol.com... : IIRC, the "NX" designation is for prototypes- like the original (Sisko's) : Defiant. Sisko's 2nd pocket destroyer came after Starfleet was making : Defiant-class ships as a regular line, so they would have the traditional "NCC" : numbers. If DS9 repeats I'll try to pay more attention. <G> Wait, I was trying to interpret a picture I have of the old DS9 Defiant. If you look, around 5th Season, the DS9 Defiant changes from the NX prototype-designation to NCC. Sorry about that.

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"DanielSBen" <danielsben@aol.com> wrote in message news:20000625105748.22480.00003385@ng-cv1.aol.com... : I have a different idea on how Voyager should go home. A new starfleet : vessel will be commissioned with a stolen (from the borg) transwarp drive. : Then, it would rescue Voyager. Some Admiral will dole out shore leave and : promotions (Commander Tuvok, Lt. Comm. Torres, Lt. (full) Kim and Paris, etc.). : Afterwords, a Transwarp-capable Voyager-A will be launched, complete with a : bunch of missions for movies (how about finding Ocampa under attack by : Kazon(Jennifer Lien guest-starring), Neelix finding his supposedly dead sister, : and a couple of crashes by Chakotay and Paris on the Delta Flyer III). Why can't it just be a retrofitted Voyager, instead of a supposed "Voyager-A", kind of like the retrofitted Enterprise in ST1 or the retrofitted Lakarta in the DS9 episode Paradise Lost (I think) (btw... there will never be a Voyager-A. This is a whole massive, messed up YATI. The Enterprise is the only vessel in the fleet that carries on it's original naval construction code. You'll notice that the current USS Defiant carries a different number from the Defiant seen on TOS.)

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Wickeddoll <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com>)


"Brian Barjenbruch" <brianb1@home.com> wrote in message news:240620001909137021%brianb1@home.com... > > With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not > > particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant > > threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really > > would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! > > I doubt there's any danger of that. My guess is, the Federation will > take Janeway's report on the Maquis and decide that they've all been > through enough, and give all the Maquis amnesty. That's what you'd think, but it looked in one ep (I forget the name) that they were planning to roast them. I hope not. > > > And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha > > Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... > > I think Picard should meet Seven. They would have an absolutely > *white-hot* romance. Oh, I think she's more Worf's type LOL. Besides, Picard is MINE dammit! hehehe Natalie >

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Wickeddoll <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com>)


"Wavemaker" <wavemaker@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:yNc55.8958$Mj72.98631986@news.randori.com... > > "Wickeddoll" wrote: > > > > And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha > > Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... > > She may be ostracized from most of society because of her Borg background. > At the very least, I think her reception in the Alpha quadrant will be > mixed. > > Also, I can imagine Starfleet's engineers and scientists being very > interested in her the same way they were in Data in "The Measure of the > Man." She may find herself in a place where she has to defend against having > her freedom, and more, violated. > Yup that's quite likely Natalie >

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Wickeddoll <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com>)


"DanielSBen" <danielsben@aol.com> wrote in message news:20000625105748.22480.00003385@ng-cv1.aol.com... > To everyone: > I have a different idea on how Voyager should go home. A new starfleet > vessel will be commissioned with a stolen (from the borg) transwarp drive. > Then, it would rescue Voyager. Some Admiral will dole out shore leave and > promotions (Commander Tuvok, Lt. Comm. Torres, Lt. (full) Kim and Paris, etc.). > Afterwords, a Transwarp-capable Voyager-A will be launched, complete with a > bunch of missions for movies (how about finding Ocampa under attack by > Kazon(Jennifer Lien guest-starring), Neelix finding his supposedly dead sister, > and a couple of crashes by Chakotay and Paris on the Delta Flyer III). > Wow, sounds action packed anyway! Natalie

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (evilklowwn@aol.comedy)


ConAndDave doth write thus: >: I have a different idea on how Voyager should go home. A new starfleet >: vessel will be commissioned with a stolen (from the borg) transwarp drive. >: Then, it would rescue Voyager. Some Admiral will dole out shore leave and >: promotions (Commander Tuvok, Lt. Comm. Torres, Lt. (full) Kim and Paris, >etc.). >: Afterwords, a Transwarp-capable Voyager-A will be launched, complete with >a >: bunch of missions for movies (how about finding Ocampa under attack by >: Kazon(Jennifer Lien guest-starring), Neelix finding his supposedly dead >sister, >: and a couple of crashes by Chakotay and Paris on the Delta Flyer III). > >Why can't it just be a retrofitted Voyager, instead of a supposed >"Voyager-A", kind of like the retrofitted Enterprise in ST1 or the >retrofitted Lakarta in the DS9 episode Paradise Lost (I think) The original Voyager is going to be *intensely* studied for its Borg/slipstream/other tech. Starfleet may even tempt B'Elanna by bumping her up to Lt. Cmdr. to get her to stay on at Utopia Planitia while Voyager's new tech is being back-engineered. >(btw... >there will never be a Voyager-A. This is a whole massive, messed up YATI. >The Enterprise is the only vessel in the fleet that carries on it's original >naval construction code. You'll notice that the current USS Defiant carries >a different number from the Defiant seen on TOS.) I thought the "current" Defiant was Defiant-A, after the first of the Defiant-class pocket destroyers was destroyed a few episodes before DS9's finale. ***************************************** "Insanity is a part of the times, Vir: You must learn to *embrace* the madness!!" Londo Mollari

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"Bozo the Evil Klown" <evilklowwn@aol.comedy> wrote in message news:20000625142416.04767.00000847@ng-cp1.aol.com... : >(btw... : >there will never be a Voyager-A. This is a whole massive, messed up YATI. : >The Enterprise is the only vessel in the fleet that carries on it's original : >naval construction code. You'll notice that the current USS Defiant carries : >a different number from the Defiant seen on TOS.) : : I thought the "current" Defiant was Defiant-A, after the first of the : Defiant-class pocket destroyers was destroyed a few episodes before DS9's : finale. Well, there was already a Defiant *before* the Defiant we all knew and loved (without the ugly carpets, that wasn't just a renamed USS Sao Paulo or whatever) back in TOS. And, we can assume that there were other Defiants after that but before the DS9 Defiant. And we know for fact that the Defiant didn't have the original Defiant construction numbers (the new one was something like NX-75791, don't remember exactly). While they are all in the line of Defiant named ships, they are not, unlike the Enterprise, referred to by a letter suffix.

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (evilklowwn@aol.comedy)


ConAndDave doth write thus: >: I thought the "current" Defiant was Defiant-A, after the first of the >: Defiant-class pocket destroyers was destroyed a few episodes before DS9's >: finale. > >Well, there was already a Defiant *before* the Defiant we all knew and loved >(without the ugly carpets, that wasn't just a renamed USS Sao Paulo or >whatever) back in TOS. And, we can assume that there were other Defiants >after that but before the DS9 Defiant. And we know for fact that the >Defiant didn't have the original Defiant construction numbers (the new one >was something like NX-75791, don't remember exactly). While they are all in >the line of Defiant named ships, they are not, unlike the Enterprise, >referred to by a letter suffix. IIRC, the "NX" designation is for prototypes- like the original (Sisko's) Defiant. Sisko's 2nd pocket destroyer came after Starfleet was making Defiant-class ships as a regular line, so they would have the traditional "NCC" numbers. If DS9 repeats I'll try to pay more attention. <G> ***************************************** "Insanity is a part of the times, Vir: You must learn to *embrace* the madness!!" Londo Mollari

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (danielsben@aol.com)


To everyone: I have a different idea on how Voyager should go home. A new starfleet vessel will be commissioned with a stolen (from the borg) transwarp drive. Then, it would rescue Voyager. Some Admiral will dole out shore leave and promotions (Commander Tuvok, Lt. Comm. Torres, Lt. (full) Kim and Paris, etc.). Afterwords, a Transwarp-capable Voyager-A will be launched, complete with a bunch of missions for movies (how about finding Ocampa under attack by Kazon(Jennifer Lien guest-starring), Neelix finding his supposedly dead sister, and a couple of crashes by Chakotay and Paris on the Delta Flyer III).

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (evilklowwn@aol.comedy)


WickexdDoll doth write thus: >With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not >particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant >threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really >would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! I want to see the engineers sweat a little over it, *not* just have Q or Kes or Braga just snap their fingers and Lo, it is done! *And* come home with a couple or three eps to spare, not in the finale act of the series finale. >Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their >feelings for each other, or get on with it! TPTB cannot write realistic, emotionally verisimilitudinistic romance. By now, they should know better than to try. >And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha >Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... OK, I can imagine one thing >some of them would want to do with her, but you know what I mean. ;) Watch Voyager get home at the same time a ship full of refugees fleeing the Borg show up..... ***************************************** "Insanity is a part of the times, Vir: You must learn to *embrace* the madness!!" Londo Mollari

2000-06-25 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>> I want to see the engineers sweat a little over it, *not* just have Q or Kes or Braga just snap their fingers and Lo, it is done! << Agreed. Especially since they've come so close to getting home on their own in previous episodes. >> TPTB cannot write realistic, emotionally verisimilitudinistic romance. By now, they should know better than to try. << Yup. >> Watch Voyager get home at the same time a ship full of refugees fleeing the Borg show up..... << Ack! Don't give them any ideas.... -- Arlie

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>> I dont find it as nauseating as P/T, purely because its only ever been hinted at and I do like the chemistry between the two, whereas P/T has been brought into the open and completely destroyed by the writing and the fact that there is no chemistry between the characters at all. << You're right...but this season, P/T is so bad it's good! <g> -- Arlie

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Merrick Baldelli <mbaldelli@mindspring.com>)


On 25 Jun 2000 18:24:16 GMT, evilklowwn@aol.comedy (Bozo the Evil Klown) wrote: >The original Voyager is going to be *intensely* studied for its >Borg/slipstream/other tech. Why? None of it worked and all of it has been scrapped. >Starfleet may even tempt B'Elanna by bumping her up to Lt. Cmdr. to >get her to stay on at Utopia Planitia while Voyager's new >tech is being back-engineered. Eh, sounds like a plan.

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Mon, 26 Jun 2000 21:18:20 GMT, "Lisa" <lisa@chakfan.com> wrote: >Julianna wrote > >> >> >> >> Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their >> >> feelings for each other, or get on with it! >> > >> >They should have left it dead and buried, for the life of me I dont >> >understand why they have started hinting at it again. >> > >> >> >> me neither - it's about the most nauseating thing in the world - along >> with P/T > >I dont find it as nauseating as P/T, purely because its only ever been >hinted at and I do like the chemistry between the two, whereas P/T has been >brought into the open and completely destroyed by the writing and the fact >that there is no chemistry between the characters at all. > not that I see all that much chemistry between J and C... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Sat, 24 Jun 2000 22:48:11 GMT, "Lisa" <lisa@chakfan.com> wrote: > >"Wickeddoll" <wickeddoll@nofeckingspamhotmail.com> wrote in message >news:kGa55.37303$FC6.848527@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net... >> With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not >> particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant >> threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really >> would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! > >I'm hoping for there to be a Maquis revival. I'd like to see them worried >about Starfleets intentions towards them,( as hinted at in one ep this >season that I cant remember the name of because I've got a cold and I'm >knackered <g>) and considering abandoning ship or something like that. Then >we could have Tom in a dilemma over leaving B'Elana, Seven might decide to >opt out as well, Tuvok would remain true to Starfleet, Harry would probably >love to go but not have enough guts to do it. It could provide for some >very interesting conflict. > >> >> Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their >> feelings for each other, or get on with it! > >They should have left it dead and buried, for the life of me I dont >understand why they have started hinting at it again. > me neither - it's about the most nauseating thing in the world - along with P/T >> And how the heck will 7 rejoin humanity? I can't imagine any Alpha >> Quadranters wanting anything to do with her... OK, I can imagine one thing >> some of them would want to do with her, but you know what I mean. ;) > >LOL, I can think of a couple of places in Texas and Washington where there >are two people who would love to help her discover herself <g> > LOL! Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Lisa <lisa@chakfan.com>)


Julianna wrote > >> > >> Don't hurt me, but I would like to see J/C either formally deny their > >> feelings for each other, or get on with it! > > > >They should have left it dead and buried, for the life of me I dont > >understand why they have started hinting at it again. > > > > > me neither - it's about the most nauseating thing in the world - along > with P/T I dont find it as nauseating as P/T, purely because its only ever been hinted at and I do like the chemistry between the two, whereas P/T has been brought into the open and completely destroyed by the writing and the fact that there is no chemistry between the characters at all. Lisa

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - ("David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com>)


conANDave wrote: > > "Bozo the Evil Klown" <evilklowwn@aol.comedy> wrote in message > news:20000625144848.04767.00000854@ng-cp1.aol.com... > : IIRC, the "NX" designation is for prototypes- like the original (Sisko's) > : Defiant. Sisko's 2nd pocket destroyer came after Starfleet was making > : Defiant-class ships as a regular line, so they would have the traditional > "NCC" > : numbers. If DS9 repeats I'll try to pay more attention. <G> > > Wait, I was trying to interpret a picture I have of the old DS9 Defiant. If > you look, around 5th Season, the DS9 Defiant changes from the NX > prototype-designation to NCC. Sorry about that. And later seasons show it with NX. All the battle scenes showing the Defiant in "The Sacrifice of Angels" have it with the NX designation.

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (evilklowwn@aol.comedy)


ConAndDave doth write thus: >Wait, I was trying to interpret a picture I have of the old DS9 Defiant. If >you look, around 5th Season, the DS9 Defiant changes from the NX >prototype-designation to NCC. Sorry about that. Not a prob..... was that around the time of "Homefront/Paradise Lost," when Defiant was in the neighborhood? ***************************************** "Insanity is a part of the times, Vir: You must learn to *embrace* the madness!!" Londo Mollari

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (juli17@aol.com)


> >"Brian Barjenbruch" <brianb1@home.com> wrote in message >news:240620001909137021%brianb1@home.com... >> > With the Maquis Voyager crew (with a little help from Janeway, but not >> > particularly her) saving the Federation's butt from some Delta Quadrant >> > threat. I think that way, all the Maquis could be exonerated. I really >> > would like to see them end up someplace other than a borite mine! >> >> I doubt there's any danger of that. My guess is, the Federation will >> take Janeway's report on the Maquis and decide that they've all been >> through enough, and give all the Maquis amnesty. > >That's what you'd think, but it looked in one ep (I forget the name) that >they were planning to roast them. I hope not. > In "Lifeline" the admiral Janeway spoke to mentioned the Maquis, and in a way that made it sound as if he thought after six years that the former Maquis were still a separate faction rather than an integrated part of Janeway's crew. It did seem a little like foreshadowing but I hope not. The Maquis would never be convicted, but even a trial would be stupid. It will have been nearly seven years since they committed their "crimes," the Federation has been through a devastating war since, so why would Starfleet still hold a major grudge on that issue? The Voyager crew will return to the Federation having survived a perilous journey, having made their way through various hostile territories, and bringing with them a vast quantity of hitherto unknown knowledge about the Delta quadrant. I think we can assume that by the end of Unimatrix Zero Part Two it is likely the Voyager crew will also have delivered a devastating blow to the Borg Collective (at great personal risk), perhaps ending the Borg threat to the Federation's many populated planets for good. Not to mention having pushed back the original invasion by Species 8472, which saved untold lives also. Given all this, Starfleet/the Federation should welcome them back as heroes, the -exMaquis crewmembers (who have been an integral part of it) included. I'm sure the issue of the Maquis would come up, but it should be resolved quickly with pardons/amnesty rather than any trials, which would only be to serve melodrama rather than justice. IMO of course ;-) Julie

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:3956CE50.68AAF6D7@hotmail.com... : And later seasons show it with NX. All the battle scenes showing the : Defiant in "The Sacrifice of Angels" have it with the NX designation. True. But, they did change it to NCC. Often, there would still be NX shots when they recycled ship shots.

2000-06-26 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"Brian Barjenbruch" <brianb1@home.com> wrote in message news:250620002240201167%brianb1@home.com... : In article <20000625142416.04767.00000847@ng-cp1.aol.com>, Bozo the : Evil Klown <evilklowwn@aol.comedy> wrote: : : > I thought the "current" Defiant was Defiant-A, after the first of the : > Defiant-class pocket destroyers was destroyed a few episodes before DS9's : > finale. : : No...the original (Constitution-class) Defiant was NCC-1764 or : something like that. The second one, the one we usually saw on DS9, : was NX-74205; the third one, i.e. the former Sao Paulo, was NCC-75633. : : The third Defiant was incorrectly shown as NX-74205 in one battle : scene but this was because of a piece of incorrectly placed stock : footage. Starfleet had to get special permission to change the ship's : *name* and AFAIK, they left the number as NCC-75633.. Yes, what he said. (He even got the numbers right, wow!)

2000-06-27 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (StarKitty <starkitty__@hotmail.com>)


Merrick Baldelli <mbaldelli@mindspring.com> wrote in message news:8i6flscf91b7fkpp33rua32bd80kaa0ra4@4ax.com... > On 25 Jun 2000 18:24:16 GMT, evilklowwn@aol.comedy (Bozo the Evil > Klown) wrote: > > >The original Voyager is going to be *intensely* studied for its > >Borg/slipstream/other tech. > > Why? None of it worked and all of it has been scrapped. Well, the ship was configured incorrectly for the newer types of drives. If they'd had the resources to completely reconfigure Voyager, they'd be home by now after having used the slipstream drive. JMHO. StarKitty > > >Starfleet may even tempt B'Elanna by bumping her up to Lt. Cmdr. to > >get her to stay on at Utopia Planitia while Voyager's new > >tech is being back-engineered. > > Eh, sounds like a plan. > > >

2000-06-27 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (evilklowwn@aol.comedy)


Merrick doth write thus: >evilklowwn@aol.comedy (Bozo the Evil >Klown) wrote: > >>The original Voyager is going to be *intensely* studied for its >>Borg/slipstream/other tech. > > Why? None of it worked and all of it has been scrapped. Some of it worked up to a point; I still have *no* idea why Janeway ordered the Borg defenses removed from Voyager in "The Gift." >>Starfleet may even tempt B'Elanna by bumping her up to Lt. Cmdr. to >>get her to stay on at Utopia Planitia while Voyager's new >>tech is being back-engineered. > > Eh, sounds like a plan. Well, I'm guessing Seven will be occupied by *enthusiastic* debriefings from Section 31. ***************************************** "Insanity is a part of the times, Vir: You must learn to *embrace* the madness!!" Londo Mollari

2000-06-27 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (conANDave <conandave@email.com>)


"Bozo the Evil Klown" <evilklowwn@aol.comedy> wrote in message news:20000626215956.06487.00000766@ng-cl1.aol.com... : Some of it worked up to a point; I still have *no* idea why Janeway ordered the : Borg defenses removed from Voyager in "The Gift." Maybe it's a whole "Use Starfleet" tirade she's on You know, kind of like how, back in the 80s, there was that whole "Buy American" thing? (*snicker* Buy American, yeah right...)

2000-06-28 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Merrick Baldelli <mbaldelli@mindspring.com>)


On 27 Jun 2000 01:59:56 GMT, evilklowwn@aol.comedy (Bozo the Evil Klown) wrote: >Some of it worked up to a point; I still have *no* idea why Janeway ordered the >Borg defenses removed from Voyager in "The Gift." Simple -- it was inhibiting the normal functions of the ship. They removed it because it was acting like a cancer. >> Eh, sounds like a plan. > >Well, I'm guessing Seven will be occupied by *enthusiastic* debriefings from >Section 31. While the dissect Janeway to figure out why on earth she became a Captain. -- -=-=-/ )=*=-='=-.-'-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= _( (_ , '_ * . Merrick Baldelli (((\ \> /_1 ` UIN#: 788639 (\\\\ \_/ / -=-\ /-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- \ _/ / /

2000-06-29 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (F_Lee <fionablue47@DIESPAMDIEhotmail.com>)


Merrick Baldelli wrote in message <8i6flscf91b7fkpp33rua32bd80kaa0ra4@4ax.com>... >On 25 Jun 2000 18:24:16 GMT, evilklowwn@aol.comedy (Bozo the Evil >Klown) wrote: > >>The original Voyager is going to be *intensely* studied for its >>Borg/slipstream/other tech. > > Why? None of it worked and all of it has been scrapped. > >>Starfleet may even tempt B'Elanna by bumping her up to Lt. Cmdr. to >>get her to stay on at Utopia Planitia while Voyager's new >>tech is being back-engineered. > > Eh, sounds like a plan. > I find it hard to believe that Torres would stay with Starfleet after everything she's been through with the Maquis. She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with him as testpilot. After six years on Voyager, I don't think she even considers herself as Starfleet - she's loyal only to Janeway and Voyager. A promotion would be nice though, just before she throws their job offer back in SF's face! :-) F. >

2000-06-30 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Merrick Baldelli <mbaldelli@mindspring.com>)


On Thu, 29 Jun 2000 09:54:51 GMT, "F_Lee" <fionablue47@DIESPAMDIEhotmail.com> wrote: >I find it hard to believe that Torres would stay with Starfleet after >everything she's been through with the Maquis. Why not? She's been properly assimilated into the Federation under the Fed-Queen Janeway's actions. >She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with >him as testpilot. Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). >A promotion would be nice though, just before she throws their job offer >back in SF's face! :-) I still think she's been properly assimilated, considering what Janeway said to her about what some of her teachers and instructors at the Academy had to say about her behind her back. -- -=-=-/ )=*=-='=-.-'-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= _( (_ , '_ * . Merrick Baldelli (((\ \> /_1 ` UIN#: 788639 (\\\\ \_/ / -=-\ /-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- \ _/ / /

2000-06-30 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with >him as testpilot. Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager is too sentimental not to go that route. I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet dad and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that Paris and Torres are still together. -- Arlie

2000-07-01 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>> Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. << I'd like to see Torres' parents. At this point, I find them more interesting than Tom's dad. (Though I wonder what happened to Tom's mom. He never even mentions her.) >> It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 Doc/Federation eps.... << Ack! (runs away screaming> -- Arlie

2000-07-01 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message news:20000701164518.01516.00001998@ng-md1.aol.com... > >> Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. << > > I'd like to see Torres' parents. At this point, I find them more interesting > than Tom's dad. (Though I wonder what happened to Tom's mom. He never even > mentions her.) That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must hate moms. Almost all of the characters have strong, influential fathers (Tuvok, Janeway, Paris, Chakotay, Kes, even the Doc) and their moms are rarely mentioned. Of course moms never have an influence on their children.<insert sarcasm here> Even with the StarFleet standouts Harry and Janeway we only have brief bits of information about their moms. When you add that the only child on Voyager is never with her mother and that they have to manuafacture these quasi-maternal relationships (like the Mommy Janeway/teenager Seven that they bludgeoned us with), it's kind of insulting. > > >> It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 > Doc/Federation eps.... << > > Ack! (runs away screaming> > > > -- Arlie <g>....my feelings exactly! Doreen

2000-07-01 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... > >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with > >him as testpilot. > > Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and > pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again > (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << > > No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager is > too sentimental not to go that route. > > I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet dad > and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that Paris > and Torres are still together. > > > -- Arlie LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 Doc/Federation eps.... Doreen

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - ("EvilBill[AGQx]" <evilbill25NOSPAM@freeuk.com>)


"Masked Man" <kemosabe@skyenet.net> wrote in message > > Masked Man----->Case could be made that TV hates dads, too. Al Bundy, > Homer Simpson, and Jack Molloy are hardly paragons of fatherhood.... > Homer Simpson is cool! :-) "D'oh!" -- * Has anyone seen my planet-killer? I'm sure I left it around here somewhere... ICQ: 37464244 Remove NOSPAM to reply by e-mail.

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>> That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must hate moms. Almost all of the characters have strong, influential fathers (Tuvok, Janeway, Paris, Chakotay, Kes, even the Doc) and their moms are rarely mentioned. Of course moms never have an influence on their children.<insert sarcasm here> << This was blatantly obvious in Jeri Taylor's book, "Pathways." Just about all the characters had major issues with their fathers, while their mothers weren't very important. Even Torres, who was apparently raised by her mom, seemed more influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. -- Arlie

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Masked Man" <kemosabe@skyenet.net> wrote in message news:39648870.74257637@news.skyenet.net... > On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 18:47:47 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > |That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must > |hate moms. > > Masked Man----->Case could be made that TV hates dads, too. Al Bundy, > Homer Simpson, and Jack Molloy are hardly paragons of fatherhood.... Would never disagree here. The fathers that Voyager has created are infinitely better. The stories about the shaping of these characters and their parents (Tattoo, Gravity, Barge of the Dead, Lifesigns, Coda, Mortal Coil <re: family>, and I can't remember the ep with Kes...<sigh> , even the one where Tom doesn't get the message from his Dad) are among my favorites. Doreen

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:395EA316.948C9B7F@hotmail.com... > Doreen Hartz wrote: > > > > "Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message > > news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... > > > >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with > > > >him as testpilot. > > > > > > Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and > > > pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again > > > (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << > > > > > > No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager > > is > > > too sentimental not to go that route. > > > > > > I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet > > dad > > > and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that > > Paris > > > and Torres are still together. > > > > > > > > > -- Arlie > > > > LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! > > Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > > the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. > > It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 > > Doc/Federation eps.... > > Isn't Chakotay's father dead? I'm about 90% sure that he is. 100% here...I was referring to B'Elanna's Dad. Doreen

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:395EA34B.7EB5918B@hotmail.com... > Arlie wrote: > > > > >> Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > > the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. << > > > > I'd like to see Torres' parents. At this point, I find them more interesting > > than Tom's dad. (Though I wonder what happened to Tom's mom. He never even > > mentions her.) > > I assume that she's dead. Yes, but they did kind of leave that open to interpretation in "Barge of the Dead". Doreen

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message news:20000702063834.02051.00001947@ng-md1.aol.com... > >> That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must > hate moms. Almost all of the characters have strong, influential fathers > (Tuvok, Janeway, Paris, Chakotay, Kes, even the Doc) and their moms are > rarely mentioned. Of course moms never have an influence on their > children.<insert sarcasm here> << > > This was blatantly obvious in Jeri Taylor's book, "Pathways." Just about all > the characters had major issues with their fathers, while their mothers weren't > very important. Even Torres, who was apparently raised by her mom, seemed more > influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that > Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. > > > -- Arlie I thought that too when I read it. But on the other hand, that only accounts for a couple years of the show (and Coda). The trend has continued with the writers under Braga, not to mention how they use Naomi. Doreen Doreen

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (kemosabe@skyenet.net)


On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 18:47:47 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: |That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must |hate moms. Masked Man----->Case could be made that TV hates dads, too. Al Bundy, Homer Simpson, and Jack Molloy are hardly paragons of fatherhood.... -- Who was that masked man?

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - ("David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com>)


Doreen Hartz wrote: > > "Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message > news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... > > >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with > > >him as testpilot. > > > > Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and > > pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again > > (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << > > > > No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager > is > > too sentimental not to go that route. > > > > I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet > dad > > and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that > Paris > > and Torres are still together. > > > > > > -- Arlie > > LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! > Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. > It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 > Doc/Federation eps.... Isn't Chakotay's father dead? I'm about 90% sure that he is.

2000-07-02 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - ("David B." <bothecat@hotmail.com>)


Arlie wrote: > > >> Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. << > > I'd like to see Torres' parents. At this point, I find them more interesting > than Tom's dad. (Though I wonder what happened to Tom's mom. He never even > mentions her.) I assume that she's dead.

2000-07-03 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>>> influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that > Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. I thought that too when I read it. But on the other hand, that only accounts for a couple years of the show (and Coda). The trend has continued with the writers under Braga, not to mention how they use Naomi. << Well, we have seen B'Elanna's mom. But I think the current crop of writers has trouble writing female characters in general. They actually do the mother-child relationship better than any other female relationship. Which isn't saying much, I'll concede. -- Arlie

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Wed, 5 Jul 2000 16:37:42 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:em77msgn9qb7hmqm0l1tp29cjcu5uj03vq@4ax.com... >> On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 09:43:10 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message >> >news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... >> >> >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with >> >> >him as testpilot. >> >> >> >> Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and >> >> pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again >> >> (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << >> >> >> >> No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. >Voyager >> >is >> >> too sentimental not to go that route. >> >> >> >> I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to >meet >> >dad >> >> and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists >that >> >Paris >> >> and Torres are still together. >> >> >> >> >> >> -- Arlie >> > >> >LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! >> >Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of >> >the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the >AQ. >> >It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 >> >Doc/Federation eps.... >> >> better half an ep than somebody else mentioning that Tuvok has left >> for Vulcan to meet his family and we don't see him *at all*... >> >> Julianna > >I'm not as pessismistic as you Julianna...I think Tuvok meeting his family >would be the other half of the B'Elanna/Chakotay story... >but like you, I think it would be all they do for the three of them. You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the 26 eps left. Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On 05 Jul 2000 21:48:18 GMT, arlie88@aol.comNoSpam (Arlie) wrote: >>>>This was blatantly obvious in Jeri Taylor's book, "Pathways." Just about >all >>the characters had major issues with their fathers, while their mothers >weren't >>very important. Even Torres, who was apparently raised by her mom, seemed >more >>influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that >>Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. >> > >How about Tuvok and his mother? << > >Tuvok was the only one in the book who had a mother as "real" as the fathers in >the books. > and she was just as overbearing and dominant as all the fathers.. Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (arlie88@aol.comNoSpam)


>>>This was blatantly obvious in Jeri Taylor's book, "Pathways." Just about all >the characters had major issues with their fathers, while their mothers weren't >very important. Even Torres, who was apparently raised by her mom, seemed more >influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that >Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. > How about Tuvok and his mother? << Tuvok was the only one in the book who had a mother as "real" as the fathers in the books. -- Arlie

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:em77msgn9qb7hmqm0l1tp29cjcu5uj03vq@4ax.com... > On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 09:43:10 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > > > >"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message > >news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... > >> >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with > >> >him as testpilot. > >> > >> Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and > >> pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again > >> (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << > >> > >> No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager > >is > >> too sentimental not to go that route. > >> > >> I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet > >dad > >> and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that > >Paris > >> and Torres are still together. > >> > >> > >> -- Arlie > > > >LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! > >Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > >the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. > >It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 > >Doc/Federation eps.... > > better half an ep than somebody else mentioning that Tuvok has left > for Vulcan to meet his family and we don't see him *at all*... > > Julianna I'm not as pessismistic as you Julianna...I think Tuvok meeting his family would be the other half of the B'Elanna/Chakotay story... but like you, I think it would be all they do for the three of them. Doreen

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On 02 Jul 2000 10:38:34 GMT, arlie88@aol.comNoSpam (Arlie) wrote: >>> That's one of my big gripes with Voyager's characterizations...they must >hate moms. Almost all of the characters have strong, influential fathers >(Tuvok, Janeway, Paris, Chakotay, Kes, even the Doc) and their moms are >rarely mentioned. Of course moms never have an influence on their >children.<insert sarcasm here> << > >This was blatantly obvious in Jeri Taylor's book, "Pathways." Just about all >the characters had major issues with their fathers, while their mothers weren't >very important. Even Torres, who was apparently raised by her mom, seemed more >influenced by the dad who abandoned them. The only thing I can figure is that >Taylor has some unresolved issues with her father. > How about Tuvok and his mother? Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-05 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 09:43:10 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message >news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... >> >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with >> >him as testpilot. >> >> Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and >> pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again >> (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << >> >> No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. Voyager >is >> too sentimental not to go that route. >> >> I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to meet >dad >> and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists that >Paris >> and Torres are still together. >> >> >> -- Arlie > >LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! >Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of >the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the AQ. >It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 >Doc/Federation eps.... better half an ep than somebody else mentioning that Tuvok has left for Vulcan to meet his family and we don't see him *at all*... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-06 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:f7s9ms40chbcnan59lsr92fpkk0n7jsm7j@4ax.com... > On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 14:16:07 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > >> You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime > >> has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things > >> *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst > >> nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the > >> 26 eps left. > >> > >> Julianna > > > >LOL Julianna, while I do think that everyone's screen time has been mowed > >down by Barbie of Borg and the Doc, you do know that I disagree with you > >about Season 6. I think Tuvok has more than Season 5. > > nowhere close. He had about as much in "Riddles" as in "Gravity". But > he didn't have eps that would compare to "Night", "Once Upon a Time", > "Infinite Regress" and "Juggernaut". At least not as many. And he had > scenes in "Bride of Chaotica" and "Course: Oblivion" as well last > year. This year he more often than not barely reached the ten > lines-mark. He even had one ep without any lines and another one with > just one token line. So in two eps he had a total of 4 words. That's a > new all-time low for him. I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps WHAT Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... > > >Having said that, it certainly isn't much compared to the big 3, and no, I > >don't expect much for any of my favs in the last season :-( > > > > If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite > female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes He didn't this year > in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about > B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... I thought B'Elanna had a pretty good season too, but I am not sure that they will invest Alpha Quadrant time in her (when we could see 5 differents eps on the Federation threatening Seven...) Doreen

2000-07-06 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 14:16:07 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:mod7msc29o8lfetlf5jt01b9kv92hmnlig@4ax.com... >> On Wed, 5 Jul 2000 16:37:42 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> wrote: >> >> > >> You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime >> has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things >> *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst >> nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the >> 26 eps left. >> >> Julianna > >LOL Julianna, while I do think that everyone's screen time has been mowed >down by Barbie of Borg and the Doc, you do know that I disagree with you >about Season 6. I think Tuvok has more than Season 5. nowhere close. He had about as much in "Riddles" as in "Gravity". But he didn't have eps that would compare to "Night", "Once Upon a Time", "Infinite Regress" and "Juggernaut". At least not as many. And he had scenes in "Bride of Chaotica" and "Course: Oblivion" as well last year. This year he more often than not barely reached the ten lines-mark. He even had one ep without any lines and another one with just one token line. So in two eps he had a total of 4 words. That's a new all-time low for him. >Having said that, it certainly isn't much compared to the big 3, and no, I >don't expect much for any of my favs in the last season :-( > If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-06 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:mod7msc29o8lfetlf5jt01b9kv92hmnlig@4ax.com... > On Wed, 5 Jul 2000 16:37:42 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > > > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >news:em77msgn9qb7hmqm0l1tp29cjcu5uj03vq@4ax.com... > >> On Sat, 1 Jul 2000 09:43:10 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> > > >> >"Arlie" <arlie88@aol.comNoSpam> wrote in message > >> >news:20000630173052.02024.00001344@ng-ch1.aol.com... > >> >> >>>She would probably want to go off with Paris and design ships with > >> >> >him as testpilot. > >> >> > >> >> Test pilot in a cell perhaps. Even if he's exonerated and > >> >> pardoned, I bet he'll never fly anything in Starfleet ever again > >> >> (other than perhaps something covert, like Ro Laren). << > >> >> > >> >> No way. Tom will end up the pride of Starfleet, and of his dad. > >Voyager > >> >is > >> >> too sentimental not to go that route. > >> >> > >> >> I'm still betting that Voyager will end with Tom taking Harry home to > >meet > >> >dad > >> >> and B'Elanna taking Chuckles home to meet mom...while Braga insists > >that > >> >Paris > >> >> and Torres are still together. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> -- Arlie > >> > > >> >LOL Arlie...I could only hope!! > >> >Torres taking Chak home to meet Mom (and I think long-lost Dad) is one of > >> >the few things I think would be interesting about them returning to the > >AQ. > >> >It would be half of an ep, buried under 6 Seven/Federation and 3 > >> >Doc/Federation eps.... > >> > >> better half an ep than somebody else mentioning that Tuvok has left > >> for Vulcan to meet his family and we don't see him *at all*... > >> > >> Julianna > > > >I'm not as pessismistic as you Julianna...I think Tuvok meeting his family > >would be the other half of the B'Elanna/Chakotay story... > >but like you, I think it would be all they do for the three of them. > > You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime > has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things > *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst > nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the > 26 eps left. > > Julianna LOL Julianna, while I do think that everyone's screen time has been mowed down by Barbie of Borg and the Doc, you do know that I disagree with you about Season 6. I think Tuvok has more than Season 5. Having said that, it certainly isn't much compared to the big 3, and no, I don't expect much for any of my favs in the last season :-( Doreen

2000-07-07 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 22:22:16 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:f7s9ms40chbcnan59lsr92fpkk0n7jsm7j@4ax.com... >> On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 14:16:07 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime >> >> has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things >> >> *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst >> >> nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the >> >> 26 eps left. >> >> >> >> Julianna >> > >> >LOL Julianna, while I do think that everyone's screen time has been mowed >> >down by Barbie of Borg and the Doc, you do know that I disagree with you >> >about Season 6. I think Tuvok has more than Season 5. >> >> nowhere close. He had about as much in "Riddles" as in "Gravity". But >> he didn't have eps that would compare to "Night", "Once Upon a Time", >> "Infinite Regress" and "Juggernaut". At least not as many. And he had >> scenes in "Bride of Chaotica" and "Course: Oblivion" as well last >> year. This year he more often than not barely reached the ten >> lines-mark. He even had one ep without any lines and another one with >> just one token line. So in two eps he had a total of 4 words. That's a >> new all-time low for him. > >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps WHAT >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... > yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the character even more... >> >> >Having said that, it certainly isn't much compared to the big 3, and no, >I >> >don't expect much for any of my favs in the last season :-( >> > >> >> If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite >> female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes > >He didn't this year > No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it even remotely watchable for me?????? >> in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about >> B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... > >I thought B'Elanna had a pretty good season too, but I am not sure that they >will invest Alpha Quadrant time in her (when we could see 5 differents eps >on the Federation threatening Seven...) they are not back to the Alpha Quadrant *Yet*, so there's plenty of time for her this season... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-08 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:na8cms4q7621rtn7g4v7jvi38t63e8fkgg@4ax.com... > On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 22:22:16 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > > > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >news:f7s9ms40chbcnan59lsr92fpkk0n7jsm7j@4ax.com... > >> On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 14:16:07 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> >> You *have* seen the past three seasons, don't you? Tuvok's screentime > >> >> has been constantly dropping and every time when we thought things > >> >> *couldn't* possibly get worse they got even worse than our worst > >> >> nightmares. I bet he won't have more than 300 lines *total* in all the > >> >> 26 eps left. > >> >> > >> >> Julianna > >> > > >> >LOL Julianna, while I do think that everyone's screen time has been mowed > >> >down by Barbie of Borg and the Doc, you do know that I disagree with you > >> >about Season 6. I think Tuvok has more than Season 5. > >> > >> nowhere close. He had about as much in "Riddles" as in "Gravity". But > >> he didn't have eps that would compare to "Night", "Once Upon a Time", > >> "Infinite Regress" and "Juggernaut". At least not as many. And he had > >> scenes in "Bride of Chaotica" and "Course: Oblivion" as well last > >> year. This year he more often than not barely reached the ten > >> lines-mark. He even had one ep without any lines and another one with > >> just one token line. So in two eps he had a total of 4 words. That's a > >> new all-time low for him. > > > >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps WHAT > >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... > > > > yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe > that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the > character even more... Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok this season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. I also think that there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small moments among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater impact, because they don't have scenes to balance them out. > > >> > >> >Having said that, it certainly isn't much compared to the big 3, and no, > >I > >> >don't expect much for any of my favs in the last season :-( > >> > > >> > >> If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite > >> female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes > > > >He didn't this year > > > > No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep > for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it > even remotely watchable for me?????? Sorry, I don't count that "Chakotay's scenes", regardless of that being the only redeeming thing in Fairhaven. That is more RB redeeming a moment for me, than a Chakotay scene...it in no way furthered the character of Chakotay (but at least it didn't hurt it). Tuvok/Tim also has those types of scenes. > > >> in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about > >> B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... > > > >I thought B'Elanna had a pretty good season too, but I am not sure that they > >will invest Alpha Quadrant time in her (when we could see 5 differents eps > >on the Federation threatening Seven...) > > they are not back to the Alpha Quadrant *Yet*, so there's plenty of > time for her this season... Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager back to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February sweeps) and spend the rest of the time doing that type of story for Seven and the Doc. Doreen

2000-07-10 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Sat, 8 Jul 2000 14:13:35 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:na8cms4q7621rtn7g4v7jvi38t63e8fkgg@4ax.com... >> On Thu, 6 Jul 2000 22:22:16 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> wrote: >> >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps WHAT >> >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... >> > >> >> yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe >> that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the >> character even more... > >Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok this >season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. But we *did* see him in Season 5 - a lot more than in season 6, that is. Once Upon a Time, Infinite Regress, Gravity, Bride of Chaotica, Night, Juggernaut, Course: Oblivion: *all* of these were supporting parts of a dimension he can only dream of nowadays, where he must be grateful if he gets lines *at all*. > I also think that >there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for >characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small moments >among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater impact, >because they don't have scenes to balance them out. while for Tuvok it's the *only* moment he gets in 5 or 6 eps... >> >> If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite >> >> female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes >> > >> >He didn't this year >> > >> >> No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep >> for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it >> even remotely watchable for me?????? > >Sorry, I don't count that "Chakotay's scenes", regardless of that being the >only redeeming thing in Fairhaven. now -would you've had rather have him get space sick and laughed at by Tommy? That's what Tim got in the same ep. Or would you've rather have Chucky's scenes with Janeway in either "Good Shepherd" or "Life Line", or Tuvok's 4 words in the former and no dialogue at all in the latter? Now, who does get scenes, even if not as many as you'd like, and who doesn'T? >That is more RB redeeming a moment for me, than a Chakotay scene...it in no >way furthered the character of Chakotay (but at least it didn't hurt it). >Tuvok/Tim also has those types of scenes. > see above. He had a completely dialog-free ep where he only sat in the background like a prop. And another one where his entire dialoge consisted of the wonderful line: "I'll look into it". These are levels of humiliation RB has been spared so far - and will be spared forever. >> >> >> in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about >> >> B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... >> > >> >I thought B'Elanna had a pretty good season too, but I am not sure that >they >> >will invest Alpha Quadrant time in her (when we could see 5 differents >eps >> >on the Federation threatening Seven...) >> >> they are not back to the Alpha Quadrant *Yet*, so there's plenty of >> time for her this season... > >Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager back >to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February sweeps) and >spend the rest of the time doing that type of story for Seven and the Doc. > All I can tell you is: if I were in your position I'd not be half as depressed as you are. For Chucky there is still hope, especially if mummy Enberg comes back as some spoiler sites seem to suggest. Only for Tim this would make things even worse. Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-12 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:l92kms0tqosr9spbq46qr77qjb11hfjqh8@4ax.com... > On Sat, 8 Jul 2000 14:13:35 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > wrote: > > >> >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps WHAT > >> >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... > >> > > >> > >> yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe > >> that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the > >> character even more... > > > >Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok this > >season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. > > But we *did* see him in Season 5 - a lot more than in season 6, that > is. Once Upon a Time, Infinite Regress, Gravity, Bride of Chaotica, > Night, Juggernaut, Course: Oblivion: *all* of these were supporting > parts of a dimension he can only dream of nowadays, where he must be > grateful if he gets lines *at all*. Ok, I think I misunderstood you. I know that you believe Season 6 was worse for Tuvok than Season 5. I thought Tuvok was more involved in Season 6, but I will bow to your greater knowledge of the character :-) > > > I also think that > >there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for > >characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small moments > >among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater impact, > >because they don't have scenes to balance them out. > > while for Tuvok it's the *only* moment he gets in 5 or 6 eps... Several cast members had eps like that this year > > > >> >> If I were as keen on Chucky as you are with B'Elanna my favorite > >> >> female I wouldn't be worried *at all*. Chucky *always* gets his scenes > >> > > >> >He didn't this year > >> > > >> > >> No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep > >> for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it > >> even remotely watchable for me?????? > > > >Sorry, I don't count that "Chakotay's scenes", regardless of that being the > >only redeeming thing in Fairhaven. > > now -would you've had rather have him get space sick and laughed at by > Tommy? That's what Tim got in the same ep. No... I know they like to use human/vulcan misunderstandings just about as much as they like to play the "lovely becoming human" card. Or would you've rather have > Chucky's scenes with Janeway in either "Good Shepherd" or "Life Line", > or Tuvok's 4 words in the former and no dialogue at all in the latter? > Now, who does get scenes, even if not as many as you'd like, and who > doesn'T? I don't disagree that Tim doesn't get a lot of scenes either Julianna, but there were eps like Collective and whatever the Icheb ep was where Chakotay had about 6 lines and then vanished. > > >That is more RB redeeming a moment for me, than a Chakotay scene...it in no > >way furthered the character of Chakotay (but at least it didn't hurt it). > >Tuvok/Tim also has those types of scenes. > > > > see above. He had a completely dialog-free ep where he only sat in the > background like a prop. And another one where his entire dialoge > consisted of the wonderful line: "I'll look into it". These are levels > of humiliation RB has been spared so far - and will be spared forever. That may be true, but that's more because Chakotay is the XO and they can always do those bridge moments and captain/XO for him, rather than their willingness to use the actor or the character. > > >> > >> >> in and these writers just showed with "Muse" that they *do* care about > >> >> B'ELanna and Roxann. *Her* nosedive is over... > >> > > >> >I thought B'Elanna had a pretty good season too, but I am not sure that > >they > >> >will invest Alpha Quadrant time in her (when we could see 5 differents > >eps > >> >on the Federation threatening Seven...) > >> > >> they are not back to the Alpha Quadrant *Yet*, so there's plenty of > >> time for her this season... > > > >Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager back > >to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February sweeps) and > >spend the rest of the time doing that type of story for Seven and the Doc. > > > > All I can tell you is: if I were in your position I'd not be half as > depressed as you are. For Chucky there is still hope, especially if > mummy Enberg comes back as some spoiler sites seem to suggest. Only > for Tim this would make things even worse. > > Julianna Well, so far no episode focusing on Chakotay in spoilers and he was the only character not to have an episode in Season 6. If they write some good scenes that actually have some character growth, I'll be happy. I'm not expecting it though. Doreen

2000-07-19 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 14:07:28 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:l92kms0tqosr9spbq46qr77qjb11hfjqh8@4ax.com... >> On Sat, 8 Jul 2000 14:13:35 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps >WHAT >> >> >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... >> >> > >> >> >> >> yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe >> >> that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the >> >> character even more... >> > >> >Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok this >> >season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. >> >> But we *did* see him in Season 5 - a lot more than in season 6, that >> is. Once Upon a Time, Infinite Regress, Gravity, Bride of Chaotica, >> Night, Juggernaut, Course: Oblivion: *all* of these were supporting >> parts of a dimension he can only dream of nowadays, where he must be >> grateful if he gets lines *at all*. > >Ok, I think I misunderstood you. I know that you believe Season 6 was worse >for Tuvok than Season 5. I thought Tuvok was more involved in Season 6, but >I will bow to your greater knowledge of the character :-) > things have been going downhill for *years* for him, and it's getting worse almost by the week now... >> > I also think that >> >there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for >> >characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small moments >> >among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater >impact, >> >because they don't have scenes to balance them out. >> >> while for Tuvok it's the *only* moment he gets in 5 or 6 eps... > >Several cast members had eps like that this year *everybody* had at least two starring parts in the last two seasons combined. With the exception of Tim. He had none. >> >> No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep >> >> for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it >> >> even remotely watchable for me?????? >> > >> >Sorry, I don't count that "Chakotay's scenes", regardless of that being >the >> >only redeeming thing in Fairhaven. >> >> now -would you've had rather have him get space sick and laughed at by >> Tommy? That's what Tim got in the same ep. > >No... >I know they like to use human/vulcan misunderstandings just about as much as >they like to play the "lovely becoming human" card. and Tim is becoming more and more the laughing stock of the series > Or would you've rather have >> Chucky's scenes with Janeway in either "Good Shepherd" or "Life Line", >> or Tuvok's 4 words in the former and no dialogue at all in the latter? >> Now, who does get scenes, even if not as many as you'd like, and who >> doesn'T? > >I don't disagree that Tim doesn't get a lot of scenes either Julianna, but >there were eps like Collective and whatever the Icheb ep was where Chakotay >had about 6 lines and then vanished. And what on earth did Tim have in that Icheb ep??? He went down to the planet with Janeway to do exactly *nothing* there! Chucky at least was presented as her good friend she went to the science fair with. Considering that *Tuvok* is the one with a background in sciences ("Flashback", where he was a Science Officer), that's rather odd, wouldn't you say? None of the projects the kids had worked on were of the anthropology/paleontology variety, all were based on biology, physics, meteorology etc. Not exactly Chucky's area, rather Tuvok's. Yet it was *Chucky* she took to that fair... >> >> >That is more RB redeeming a moment for me, than a Chakotay scene...it in >no >> >way furthered the character of Chakotay (but at least it didn't hurt it). >> >Tuvok/Tim also has those types of scenes. >> > >> >> see above. He had a completely dialog-free ep where he only sat in the >> background like a prop. And another one where his entire dialogue >> consisted of the wonderful line: "I'll look into it". These are levels >> of humiliation RB has been spared so far - and will be spared forever. > >That may be true, but that's more because Chakotay is the XO and they can >always do those bridge moments and captain/XO for him, rather than their >willingness to use the actor or the character. > yeah, and Tuvok is the third in command and supposedly best friend of Janeway's. Not that that helps *him* in any way... >> >Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager >back >> >to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February sweeps) sounds more like first ep of the May sweeps right now... >and >> >spend the rest of the time doing that type of story for Seven and the >Doc. >> > >> >> All I can tell you is: if I were in your position I'd not be half as >> depressed as you are. For Chucky there is still hope, especially if >> mummy Enberg comes back as some spoiler sites seem to suggest. Only >> for Tim this would make things even worse. >> >> Julianna > >Well, so far no episode focusing on Chakotay in spoilers and he was the only >character not to have an episode in Season 6. and Tim had one??????? RB had more dialogue in "One Small Step" than Tim had in either "Gravity" or "Riddles". And Chucky was *Very* close to Seven in the line count for "One Small Step", while Neelix was lightyears ahead of Tuvok in "Riddles". He had almost twice as much... The difference is, RB had *two* eps last season, Tim had none there as well > If they write some good >scenes that actually have some character growth, I'll be happy. I'm not >expecting it though. As I told you, if I had the sort of scenes for Tim that you get for RB I would still have hope... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-21 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Julianna Feigl <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com>)


On Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:54:51 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:be3cns81ntd5ta9r0g8l84thrva6jh557k@4ax.com... >> On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 14:07:28 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" >> <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: >> >> > >> >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> >news:l92kms0tqosr9spbq46qr77qjb11hfjqh8@4ax.com... >> >> On Sat, 8 Jul 2000 14:13:35 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. >Perhaps >> >WHAT >> >> >> >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe >> >> >> that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined >the >> >> >> character even more... >> >> > >> >> >Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok >this >> >> >season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. >> >> >> >> But we *did* see him in Season 5 - a lot more than in season 6, that >> >> is. Once Upon a Time, Infinite Regress, Gravity, Bride of Chaotica, >> >> Night, Juggernaut, Course: Oblivion: *all* of these were supporting >> >> parts of a dimension he can only dream of nowadays, where he must be >> >> grateful if he gets lines *at all*. >> > >> >Ok, I think I misunderstood you. I know that you believe Season 6 was >worse >> >for Tuvok than Season 5. I thought Tuvok was more involved in Season 6, >but >> >I will bow to your greater knowledge of the character :-) >> > >> >> things have been going downhill for *years* for him, and it's getting >> worse almost by the week now... > >Well he at least has an ep sceduled and one where he seems to be doing his >job not being comic relief. I doubt the script has been written yet and has not started filming - so who knows what it will end up being... >He is also doing his job as a part of the away team in UMZ2. I've heard otherwise... and it sounded *terrible* :-(( >> >> > I also think that >> >> >there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for >> >> >characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small >moments >> >> >among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater >> >impact, >> >> >because they don't have scenes to balance them out. >> >> >> >> while for Tuvok it's the *only* moment he gets in 5 or 6 eps... >> > >> >Several cast members had eps like that this year >> >> *everybody* had at least two starring parts in the last two seasons >> combined. With the exception of Tim. He had none. > >Chakotay had none is season 6 but two in season 5: "In the Flesh" and "The Fight". Tim had none there either >and you are I are not going to be able to agree on Gravity. He *did* have the smaller part, and all the interesting acting challenges went to the guy playing young Tuvok and to RDM who screwed them up as always. Tim just had to lie around passively and let himself get kissed by Lori Petty and later stand around on that cliff and listen to RDM's antics... > I might be able >to agree that Riddles was a Neelix ep, but I still don't quite see it that >way. > Neelix had *way* more dialogue than Tuvok and was in *way* more scenes than Tuvok... <snip> >> >No... >> >I know they like to use human/vulcan misunderstandings just about as much >as >> >they like to play the "lovely becoming human" card. >> >> and Tim is becoming more and more the laughing stock of the series > >No, they are just relying on age-old vulcan jokes... > which is the same, just expressed differently <snip> >> And what on earth did Tim have in that Icheb ep??? He went down to the >> planet with Janeway to do exactly *nothing* there! Chucky at least was >> presented as her good friend she went to the science fair with. > >No, they called in the Captain and XO to be the judges...that was it... I don't think they mentioned *that*. And B'Elanna was there, too, so it must've been possible for everybody to attend... >And yes, I was happy that Chak had not much to do in that ep because I hated >it...the attitude toward the parents and the writing of them was appalling, >not to mention how it wussified the Borg again... what else is new... >> Considering that *Tuvok* is the one with a background in sciences >> ("Flashback", where he was a Science Officer), that's rather odd, >> wouldn't you say? None of the projects the kids had worked on were of >> the anthropology/paleontology variety, all were based on biology, >> physics, meteorology etc. Not exactly Chucky's area, rather Tuvok's. >> Yet it was *Chucky* she took to that fair... > >See above.. >And I agree, it could have as easily been Tuvok as 3rd in command. > but it *wasn't* - since these writers don't bother to include him in a scene if there is another option <snip> > >> see above. He had a completely dialog-free ep where he only sat in the >> >> background like a prop. And another one where his entire dialogue >> >> consisted of the wonderful line: "I'll look into it". These are levels >> >> of humiliation RB has been spared so far - and will be spared forever. >> > >> >That may be true, but that's more because Chakotay is the XO and they can >> >always do those bridge moments and captain/XO for him, rather than their >> >willingness to use the actor or the character. >> > >> >> yeah, and Tuvok is the third in command and supposedly best friend of >> Janeway's. Not that that helps *him* in any way... > >No, that is because blabbermouth Captain discusses everything with >WonderBoobs, who isn't even officially a member of her crew, and who can get >away with doing anything and never have any repercussions other than going >to her alcove. > that does not stop Janeway from discussing lots of things over dinner or coffee with Chucky. In the privacy of her own quarters... Tuvok, OTOH, she has forgotten about... >> >> >> >> >Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager >> >back >> >> >to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February >sweeps) >> >> >> sounds more like first ep of the May sweeps right now... > >yes, which I prefer > I can't say I care one way or another - whatever they do it won't be anything for Tuvok. Biller is now the third producer in a row that does not even bother to mention him in an interview... :-(((((((((( <snip> >> > >> >Well, so far no episode focusing on Chakotay in spoilers and he was the >only >> >character not to have an episode in Season 6. >> >> and Tim had one??????? RB had more dialogue in "One Small Step" than >> Tim had in either "Gravity" or "Riddles". And Chucky was *Very* close >> to Seven in the line count for "One Small Step", while Neelix was >> lightyears ahead of Tuvok in "Riddles". He had almost twice as much... >> The difference is, RB had *two* eps last season, Tim had none there as >> well > >But from my point of view, the ep was originally supposed to be about >Chakotay and what happens to him as he goes through have you read Julia Houston's article regarding Beltran's comments in England??? She interprets "One Small Step" in a way that makes it *very* much a Chucky-showcase - or would have, if a certain guy had bothered to act it that way... > not just another "Seven >discovers more about humanity ep and Chakotay has to play the heavy" (how >retarded is she???...she does this 6 times a season...) > >> >> > If they write some good >> >scenes that actually have some character growth, I'll be happy. I'm not >> >expecting it though. >> >> As I told you, if I had the sort of scenes for Tim that you get for RB >> I would still have hope... > >I know, and I would agree with you if all the shows were like "Blink of an >Eye" (where Chakotay was written very well). I am crossing my fingers for >both of us this season! or "Memorial", or "On Small Step"... Tim only gets space sickness and sleeping on the bridge... Julianna -------- Tuvok: The main reason to watch Voyager!

2000-07-21 00:00:00 - Re: How I'd like to see Voyager come home... - (Doreen Hartz <dthartz@inwave.com>)


"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:be3cns81ntd5ta9r0g8l84thrva6jh557k@4ax.com... > On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 14:07:28 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" > <dthartz@inwave.com> wrote: > > > > >"Julianna Feigl" <glacierqueenNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >news:l92kms0tqosr9spbq46qr77qjb11hfjqh8@4ax.com... > >> On Sat, 8 Jul 2000 14:13:35 -0500, "Doreen Hartz" <dthartz@inwave.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> >> >I know that you are probably right but I just can't see it. Perhaps > >WHAT > >> >> >Tuvok was saying had more impact in Season 6... > >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> yeah, right - he got space sick and fell asleep on the job. Maybe > >> >> that's *memorable*, but that doesn't make it good. It only ruined the > >> >> character even more... > >> > > >> >Ok, I will agree with that. They had both good and bad for Tuvok this > >> >season instead of not seeing him at all like Season 5. > >> > >> But we *did* see him in Season 5 - a lot more than in season 6, that > >> is. Once Upon a Time, Infinite Regress, Gravity, Bride of Chaotica, > >> Night, Juggernaut, Course: Oblivion: *all* of these were supporting > >> parts of a dimension he can only dream of nowadays, where he must be > >> grateful if he gets lines *at all*. > > > >Ok, I think I misunderstood you. I know that you believe Season 6 was worse > >for Tuvok than Season 5. I thought Tuvok was more involved in Season 6, but > >I will bow to your greater knowledge of the character :-) > > > > things have been going downhill for *years* for him, and it's getting > worse almost by the week now... Well he at least has an ep sceduled and one where he seems to be doing his job not being comic relief. He is also doing his job as a part of the away team in UMZ2. > > >> > I also think that > >> >there were character damaging moments for all of the cast, but for > >> >characters like Seven, the Doc and Janeway, they are just small moments > >> >among hundreds. Whereas, for the rest of the cast, it has a greater > >impact, > >> >because they don't have scenes to balance them out. > >> > >> while for Tuvok it's the *only* moment he gets in 5 or 6 eps... > > > >Several cast members had eps like that this year > > *everybody* had at least two starring parts in the last two seasons > combined. With the exception of Tim. He had none. Chakotay had none is season 6 and you are I are not going to be able to agree on Gravity. I might be able to agree that Riddles was a Neelix ep, but I still don't quite see it that way. > > > >> >> No? Then how come you always mentioned that the J/C scene made the ep > >> >> for you when there was absolutely *nothing* in that ep that made it > >> >> even remotely watchable for me?????? > >> > > >> >Sorry, I don't count that "Chakotay's scenes", regardless of that being > >the > >> >only redeeming thing in Fairhaven. > >> > >> now -would you've had rather have him get space sick and laughed at by > >> Tommy? That's what Tim got in the same ep. > > > >No... > >I know they like to use human/vulcan misunderstandings just about as much as > >they like to play the "lovely becoming human" card. > > and Tim is becoming more and more the laughing stock of the series No, they are just relying on age-old vulcan jokes... > > > Or would you've rather have > >> Chucky's scenes with Janeway in either "Good Shepherd" or "Life Line", > >> or Tuvok's 4 words in the former and no dialogue at all in the latter? > >> Now, who does get scenes, even if not as many as you'd like, and who > >> doesn'T? > > > >I don't disagree that Tim doesn't get a lot of scenes either Julianna, but > >there were eps like Collective and whatever the Icheb ep was where Chakotay > >had about 6 lines and then vanished. > > And what on earth did Tim have in that Icheb ep??? He went down to the > planet with Janeway to do exactly *nothing* there! Chucky at least was > presented as her good friend she went to the science fair with. No, they called in the Captain and XO to be the judges...that was it... And yes, I was happy that Chak had not much to do in that ep because I hated it...the attitude toward the parents and the writing of them was appalling, not to mention how it wussified the Borg again... > Considering that *Tuvok* is the one with a background in sciences > ("Flashback", where he was a Science Officer), that's rather odd, > wouldn't you say? None of the projects the kids had worked on were of > the anthropology/paleontology variety, all were based on biology, > physics, meteorology etc. Not exactly Chucky's area, rather Tuvok's. > Yet it was *Chucky* she took to that fair... See above.. And I agree, it could have as easily been Tuvok as 3rd in command. > > >> > >> >That is more RB redeeming a moment for me, than a Chakotay scene...it in > >no > >> >way furthered the character of Chakotay (but at least it didn't hurt it). > >> >Tuvok/Tim also has those types of scenes. > >> > > >> > >> see above. He had a completely dialog-free ep where he only sat in the > >> background like a prop. And another one where his entire dialogue > >> consisted of the wonderful line: "I'll look into it". These are levels > >> of humiliation RB has been spared so far - and will be spared forever. > > > >That may be true, but that's more because Chakotay is the XO and they can > >always do those bridge moments and captain/XO for him, rather than their > >willingness to use the actor or the character. > > > > yeah, and Tuvok is the third in command and supposedly best friend of > Janeway's. Not that that helps *him* in any way... No, that is because blabbermouth Captain discusses everything with WonderBoobs, who isn't even officially a member of her crew, and who can get away with doing anything and never have any repercussions other than going to her alcove. > > > >> >Maybe, but I'm one of those people who thinks they will bring Voyager > >back > >> >to the AQ for November sweeps (if I'm lucky it will be February sweeps) > > > sounds more like first ep of the May sweeps right now... yes, which I prefer > > >and > >> >spend the rest of the time doing that type of story for Seven and the > >Doc. > >> > > >> > >> All I can tell you is: if I were in your position I'd not be half as > >> depressed as you are. For Chucky there is still hope, especially if > >> mummy Enberg comes back as some spoiler sites seem to suggest. Only > >> for Tim this would make things even worse. > >> > >> Julianna > > > >Well, so far no episode focusing on Chakotay in spoilers and he was the only > >character not to have an episode in Season 6. > > and Tim had one??????? RB had more dialogue in "One Small Step" than > Tim had in either "Gravity" or "Riddles". And Chucky was *Very* close > to Seven in the line count for "One Small Step", while Neelix was > lightyears ahead of Tuvok in "Riddles". He had almost twice as much... > The difference is, RB had *two* eps last season, Tim had none there as > well But from my point of view, the ep was originally supposed to be about Chakotay and what happens to him as he goes through not just another "Seven discovers more about humanity ep and Chakotay has to play the heavy" (how retarded is she???...she does this 6 times a season...) > > > If they write some good > >scenes that actually have some character growth, I'll be happy. I'm not > >expecting it though. > > As I told you, if I had the sort of scenes for Tim that you get for RB > I would still have hope... I know, and I would agree with you if all the shows were like "Blink of an Eye" (where Chakotay was written very well). I am crossing my fingers for both of us this season! Doreen